Re: [fast5] Re: Water and hunger

Well, I don't know what the Sioux did with pemmican, but it was still a travel food. Most of the recipes I've seen called for dried berries though.

When Sacajawea traveled with Louis and Clark, she ate tallow candles when there wasn't enough food. But she also ate the layer under the bark of some trees, dug roots, chewed leaves. The squaws were noted for digging up food as they traveled: there are roots the men derisively called "squaw root". The braves typically brought some squaws with them to do that sort of work. I don't think the braves would talk much about the "rabbit food" they might have eaten, just like until recently, guys didn't admit to actually eating salad! Men eat meat, darn it! (The Masai warriors apparently won't eat in the company of women at all, and eat only a limited diet of "warrior food").

Actually I had a relative who bragged about how he NEVER ate vegetables. He died at 52 of colon cancer though (which had probably been growing for 10 years or so before they noticed it). Statistically, it only takes one or two servings of vegies to lower your colon cancer rate by half. But he was healthy enough until he died. I'm fairly sure there are other factors in our society that lead to the high colon cancer rates, but he's one of the reasons I think a lot about butyrate.

On Wed, Jun 30, 2010 at 2:20 AM, RickS <rstewart@iaff.org> wrote:

I had read that blueberries or other berries were added by the white settlers because they didn't like the flavor of pemmican without them.  The water content in the berries would make the pemmican spoil faster.  But traditional Sioux style pemmican is all fat and meat.

he he... BAS is a phrase that I got from Mark Sisson at marksdailyapple.com .  He advocates a BAS every day.  I try to eat one  every day as it helps to fill me up and I have no craving for counter-surfing afterwards.  :)  I think that sounds really good, Heather, with the artichoke hearts, bacon, and olives!  I'll have to give that a try.  My BAS usually consists of Romaine, red cabbage, carrots, plum tomatoes, onions, jalapenos, cliantro, bell peppers, radishes, lime juice, sunflower seeds, salt and pepper, balsamic vinegar, and olive oil.  Sometimes I'll throw in broccoli and cauliflower.  Last night I also had a big bowl of steel cut oats dipped in buttermilk and a can of sardines.
 

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Re: [fast5] Re: Dr. Serrano on vegan diets.

Oh absolutely. If you look at a bunch of studies on "healthy foods", you'll find that most of the foods associated with better health, are foods that block or chelate iron. Some people take IP6 (phytate pills, basically) to block iron with meals and to chelate it, to help beat cancer. Because cancer eats iron.

When you eat whole grains with a meal, the phytate in the hull gloms onto the iron and keeps it from getting absorbed. Which is a problem if you are eating a marginal diet with not much meat in it. But if you are eating the average American diet, which is super-high in iron (since many foods are fortified), then the hull prevents over-absorption. I think phytate gloms on to mercury too, which is a nice benefit.

Tea and calcium have this effect too, by the way, and chili. Taking vitamin C with a meal though, enhances iron absorption, which might lend some credibility to the Suzanne Sommer's crowd: don't eat fruit with meat.

On Wed, Jun 30, 2010 at 2:33 AM, RickS <rstewart@iaff.org> wrote:

I was thinking about this... Oats and all grains really, but especially oats have a high phytate content which binds to minerals and can cause mineral deficiencies.  But I wonder if whole, complete, hull-on grains might almost be beneficial in keeping iron levels down??  Thoughts?

-Rick

--- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, Heather Twist <HeatherTwist@...> wrote:

> I'm still waiting for *someone* to start talking about the high ferritin
> levels that can (in some people) be caused by eating meat, grass-fed or
> otherwise. I don't think this means one shouldn't eat meat, because the heme
> iron can be blocked by taking calcium at the same meal for those people, but
> it might account for why some people feel so much better on a vegan diet.

  

 

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[fast5] Re: Dr. Serrano on vegan diets.

I was thinking about this... Oats and all grains really, but especially oats have a high phytate content which binds to minerals and can cause mineral deficiencies. But I wonder if whole, complete, hull-on grains might almost be beneficial in keeping iron levels down?? Thoughts?

-Rick

--- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, Heather Twist <HeatherTwist@...> wrote:

> I'm still waiting for *someone* to start talking about the high ferritin
> levels that can (in some people) be caused by eating meat, grass-fed or
> otherwise. I don't think this means one shouldn't eat meat, because the heme
> iron can be blocked by taking calcium at the same meal for those people, but
> it might account for why some people feel so much better on a vegan diet.

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[fast5] Re: Water and hunger

I had read that blueberries or other berries were added by the white settlers because they didn't like the flavor of pemmican without them. The water content in the berries would make the pemmican spoil faster. But traditional Sioux style pemmican is all fat and meat.

he he... BAS is a phrase that I got from Mark Sisson at marksdailyapple.com . He advocates a BAS every day. I try to eat one every day as it helps to fill me up and I have no craving for counter-surfing afterwards. :) I think that sounds really good, Heather, with the artichoke hearts, bacon, and olives! I'll have to give that a try. My BAS usually consists of Romaine, red cabbage, carrots, plum tomatoes, onions, jalapenos, cliantro, bell peppers, radishes, lime juice, sunflower seeds, salt and pepper, balsamic vinegar, and olive oil. Sometimes I'll throw in broccoli and cauliflower. Last night I also had a big bowl of steel cut oats dipped in buttermilk and a can of sardines.

I totally agree about humans as omnivores. We certainly have enzymes and system functions for meat and vegetation. We can survive on just vegetation for a while and we can survive on just meat for a while and be just fine. We can pick and choose from just about anything and the body will adapt. And since Earth's climate has changed many times in the last 2.5 million years of our development we had to survive on whatever nature threw our way. Additionally, just the changes of season bring different types of food. In the summer when it's hot, it's much easier to just pick apples and cabbage than chase down some animal and drag it back to camp, cut it open, and process all of it's parts. During the winter, the vegetation is scarce so we had to go out and hunt more for sustenance. Sometimes I'll go for a week and eat just chicken or fish. Sometimes I'll have a BAS every day. Just depends on what my body tells me it needs.

Crap, gotta get to work!

-Rick

--- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, Heather Twist <HeatherTwist@...> wrote:
>
> Actually the pemmican had berries and a lot of fat in it. Eating JUST jerky
> creates a kind of protein poisoning that the pioneers called "rabbit
> starvation". But I agree about grains, esp. wheat: it messes up digestion
> big time. Rice doesn't appear to do that so much, although it is lacking in
> nutrients: a large portion of the human population these days lives off
> white rice mostly with bits of meat and some vegies, and they live longer
> than the average person in the US.
>
> Some "meat" foods ... like eggs, shellfish, whole small fish, milk ... are
> rather balanced and people can live on them. The actual populations that
> don't do farming DO eat a lot of those kinds of foods, plus greens and
> berries and seaweed. Humans are big time omnivores, always have been! There
> is a really interesting article about this:
>
> http://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2008/12/of-neanderthals-and-dairy-farmers/
>
>
> BTW someone asked me privately what "BAS" stands for. It's our official term
> :-) for what sounds to me like a great lunch: Rick's "Big A$$ Salad". I can
> only imagine what is in his, but if it was mine, it would be a big pile of:
> lettuce, artichoke hearts, olives, roasted nuts, dried cranberries, bacon,
> tomatoes, chopped fresh herbs ... tossed with a mixture of fresh-pressed
> garlic, vinegar, and olive oil.
>

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Re: [fast5] Re: Water and hunger

Well, you have company: milk gives me migraines. Cheese too, and kefir. My husband has problems with it too. Our kids are ok with it though. I think it was the 30+ years of undiagnosed celiac that killed my digestion.

On Tue, Jun 29, 2010 at 8:00 PM, tamaratornado <tamaratornado@yahoo.com> wrote:

Thanks for the link on Neanderthals and dairy. I wish I could eat dairy without feeling badl.

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[fast5] Re: Vegetarian/Vegan???

I never heard of it before, so I just googled it.
http://gapsdiet.com/

Looks complicated!

--- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, "carolyn_graff" <zgraff@...> wrote:
>
> have you tried the GAPS diet? you might be able to handle raw dairy after doing this diet.
>
> --- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, "tamaratornado" <tamaratornado@> wrote:
> >
> > Now that I have mouthed-off, I have to admit that if I were in my teens or twenties, and I hadn't had the health problems I've had, and I hadn't done the research on nutrition that I have, I'd probably be a vegan. In fact, I am sure I would. I get it's appeal.
> >
> > When I was in my twenties, macrobiotics was the popular diet, that's what I did. Before I did macrobiotics my diet was horrible, huge amounts of sugar; so it was a big improvement.
> >
> > Last night my friend who eats similar to me, joked that she was a vegan who eats meat. I actually like a lot of vegan food. We avoid dairy. I love dairy, but it makes me feel bad. I had some high hopes for raw dairy, but it still makes me feel bad.
> >
>

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[fast5] Re: Water and hunger

Thanks for the link on Neanderthals and dairy. I wish I could eat dairy without feeling badl.

--- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, Heather Twist <HeatherTwist@...> wrote:
>
> Actually there are several cultures that live off primarily milk: and the
> Masai drink more milk than they eat blood. Milk is an exception though, in
> that it's purpose is to nourish an animal that is ONLY drinking milk, so it
> is a very complete food. Milk also has lactoferrin, so it might make
> drinking blood safer.
>
> The Masai also apparently eat a LOT of fat, as do the Inuit, and I'm
> guessing that in the circumstance where there is more fat than the body can
> use right away, some of it isn't absorbed and so that will create the needed
> butyrate. When you eat too many carbs, your body pretty much tries to absorb
> all of them anyway, but that might not be true of fat (excess fat in stools
> is pretty common).
>
> However, milk isn't "low carb" either, so if someone is avoiding salads
> because of carbs, they probably wouldn't be drinking milk either. I don't
> know how much butter you'd have to eat every day before enough of it becomes
> butyrate either.
>
> I also think the milk/blood thing is over-stressed. First, today their diet
> has changed a lot, and in the past, the scientists have often done a poor
> job of truly documenting a diet, focusing on the most visible foods (which
> are often just the ones the tribe wants to talk about). Fecal samples are a
> better measure of what people eat, and in most of those, non-farming people
> eat a wide variety of foods. But the Masai do eat other foods:
>
> -------------------------
> So far, the research team has identified some 25 plant products used by the
> Maasai Among them are latex from the Ficus tree and roots and barks of
> various plants which are chewed to alleviate thirst. A second plant gum,
> which may have hypolipidemic (serum cholesterol-lowering) properties, is
> produced by a species related to the myrrh plant. Myrrh has been valued
> since biblical times for its medicinal properties.
>
> Another source of antioxidants is *Acacia nilotica, *whose bark the Maasai
> use to flavour their meat soups and milk. Some crude acacia extracts seem to
> have stronger antioxidant properties than either vitamin C or vitamin E —
> the most popular antioxidants sold in the North.
>
> http://www.idrc.ca/en/ev-5545-201-1-DO_TOPIC.html
> -------------------------
>
> Drinking milk though is one of those things where genes make a difference.
> Some portion of the population today has ancestors who did rely a lot on
> milk, and likely those people can live off it pretty well. There is a
> fascinating look at this:
>
> http://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2008/12/of-neanderthals-and-dairy-farmers/
> <http://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2008/12/of-neanderthals-and-dairy-farmers/>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Tue, Jun 29, 2010 at 10:30 AM, carolyn_graff <zgraff@...> wrote:
>
> > what about the Masai people in Africa eating only meat, blood and milk? no
> > veggies.
> >
> > http://www.healingnaturallybybee.com/articles/foods26.php
> >
> > --- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, Heather Twist <HeatherTwist@> wrote:
> > >
> > > The BAS contains polysaccarides. Polysaccarides are "sort of" digestible
> > ...
> > > that is, your body doesn't actually use them directly, but they feed the
> > > bacteria in your lower gut. Those bacteria produce butyrate which does 2
> > > things: 1) Kills colon cancer cells and 2) Nourishes the gut cells (they
> > > prefer butyrate for fuel).
> > >
> > > The only way to get butyrate to the lower gut is to eat polysaccharides.
> > It
> > > *can* be produced from fat, notably butter, but normally the fat is
> > absorbed
> > > before it gets to the lower gut. And if you eat butyrate ... it's in some
> > > foods, but it stinks ... then it gets absorbed in the upper gut and
> > doesn't
> > > reach the colon.
> > >
> > ---
> > l
>

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Re: [fast5] Re: Water and hunger

Actually there are several cultures that live off primarily milk: and the Masai drink more milk than they eat blood. Milk is an exception though, in that it's purpose is to nourish an animal that is ONLY drinking milk, so it is a very complete food. Milk also has lactoferrin, so it might make drinking blood safer.  

The Masai also apparently eat a LOT of fat, as do the Inuit, and I'm guessing that in the circumstance where there is more fat than the body can use right away, some of it isn't absorbed and so that will create the needed butyrate. When you eat too many carbs, your body pretty much tries to absorb all of them anyway, but that might not be true of fat (excess fat in stools is pretty common).

However, milk isn't "low carb" either, so if someone is avoiding salads because of carbs, they probably wouldn't be drinking milk either. I don't know how much butter you'd have to eat every day before enough of it becomes butyrate either.

I also think the milk/blood thing is over-stressed. First, today their diet has changed a lot, and in the past, the scientists have often done a poor job of truly documenting a diet, focusing on the most visible foods (which are often just the ones the tribe wants to talk about). Fecal samples are a better measure of what people eat, and in most of those, non-farming people eat a wide variety of foods. But the Masai do eat other foods:

-------------------------

So far, the research team has identified some 25 plant products used by the Maasai Among them are latex from the Ficus tree and roots and barks of various plants which are chewed to alleviate thirst. A second plant gum, which may have hypolipidemic (serum cholesterol-lowering) properties, is produced by a species related to the myrrh plant. Myrrh has been valued since biblical times for its medicinal properties. 

Another source of antioxidants is Acacia nilotica, whose bark the Maasai use to flavour their meat soups and milk. Some crude acacia extracts seem to have stronger antioxidant properties than either vitamin C or vitamin E — the most popular antioxidants sold in the North. 

http://www.idrc.ca/en/ev-5545-201-1-DO_TOPIC.html

-------------------------

Drinking milk though is one of those things where genes make a difference. Some portion of the population today has ancestors who did rely a lot on milk, and likely those people can live off it pretty well. There is a fascinating look at this:

http://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2008/12/of-neanderthals-and-dairy-farmers/

 

On Tue, Jun 29, 2010 at 10:30 AM, carolyn_graff <zgraff@charter.net> wrote:

what about the Masai people in Africa eating only meat, blood and milk? no veggies.

http://www.healingnaturallybybee.com/articles/foods26.php

--- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, Heather Twist <HeatherTwist@...> wrote:
>
> The BAS contains polysaccarides. Polysaccarides are "sort of" digestible ...
> that is, your body doesn't actually use them directly, but they feed the
> bacteria in your lower gut. Those bacteria produce butyrate which does 2
> things: 1) Kills colon cancer cells and 2) Nourishes the gut cells (they
> prefer butyrate for fuel).
>
> The only way to get butyrate to the lower gut is to eat polysaccharides. It
> *can* be produced from fat, notably butter, but normally the fat is absorbed
> before it gets to the lower gut. And if you eat butyrate ... it's in some
> foods, but it stinks ... then it gets absorbed in the upper gut and doesn't
> reach the colon.
>
 ---
 l 

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[fast5] Re: Water and hunger

what about the Masai people in Africa eating only meat, blood and milk? no veggies.

http://www.healingnaturallybybee.com/articles/foods26.php

--- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, Heather Twist <HeatherTwist@...> wrote:
>
> The BAS contains polysaccarides. Polysaccarides are "sort of" digestible ...
> that is, your body doesn't actually use them directly, but they feed the
> bacteria in your lower gut. Those bacteria produce butyrate which does 2
> things: 1) Kills colon cancer cells and 2) Nourishes the gut cells (they
> prefer butyrate for fuel).
>
> The only way to get butyrate to the lower gut is to eat polysaccharides. It
> *can* be produced from fat, notably butter, but normally the fat is absorbed
> before it gets to the lower gut. And if you eat butyrate ... it's in some
> foods, but it stinks ... then it gets absorbed in the upper gut and doesn't
> reach the colon.
>
> So the best way to get butyrate is to eat polysaccharides. Polys also change
> motility and absorption in the gut, so food gets absorbed over a longer
> stretch of the gut, which means it might get absorbed better and it's easier
> on the gut (and you stay full longer). Polys can also chelate heavy metals
> and various toxins.
>
> Salads also typically have vinegar on them: the acetate in vinegar affects
> digestion a lot. I don't know exactly why: in studies they find it makes a
> big difference, but they only guess at the mechanism. Cider vinegar has
> malate and acetate, and both of them are substances used a lot in the body
> and affect metabolism.
>
> As for minerals that are in salad and not in meat: the one that comes to
> mind the most is potassium. There is potassium in meat too, but the meat
> usually contains a fair bit of sodium, and not all that much potassium. I'm
> not all that much up on the exact mineral contents of the various foods
> these days though. I DO know that I operate a whole lot better when I get
> vegies. There are hundreds of compounds in vegetables that aren't in meat,
> and there really isn't a culture in existence that eats ONLY meat. The
> sailors tried that and got scurvy. They might have been able to get away
> with it if they had eaten raw meat or more organ meats, but the Inuit who
> are said to be "only" meat eaters, actually ate a lot of raw fish, whole:
> and fish guts contain vegetable matter from seaweed and plankton. The plains
> Indians ate buffalo a lot, but they also apparently loved buffalo guts (full
> of half-digested grass) and gathered many kinds of wild vegies and fruits.
>
> The reverse is true too, of course: there is no culture that eats ONLY
> vegetable matter, and feeding a child a purely vegan diet ruins brain
> development. The healthiest peoples on earth seem to eat a combination of
> seafood/eggs/poultry/pork/milk/beef (in that order, roughly) and various
> plant materials, including rice and beans. The most unhealthy cultures
> appear to be the ones that rely on wheat/beef/sugar/certain oils for most
> of their calories.
>
>
> On Mon, Jun 28, 2010 at 5:14 AM, RickS <rstewart@...> wrote:
>
> > I can't find the article now but I believe that yes, it can dilute stomach
> > acid. Good point about the vinegar. I just gave up shampoo and
> > conditioner and started washing my hair with baking soda followed by a
> > conditioner of apple cider vinegar. The idea is that you shouldn't put any
> > chemicals ON your body that you wouldn't put IN your body. So far so good.
> > ;)
> >
> > How does giving up the BAS change my gut flora?
> >
> > -Rick
> >
> >
> >
>

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Re: [fast5] Re: Water and hunger

Actually the pemmican had berries and a lot of fat in it. Eating JUST jerky creates a kind of protein poisoning that the pioneers called "rabbit starvation". But I agree about grains, esp. wheat: it messes up digestion big time. Rice doesn't appear to do that so much, although it is lacking in nutrients: a large portion of the human population these days lives off white rice mostly with bits of meat and some vegies, and they live longer than the average person in the US.

Some "meat" foods ... like eggs, shellfish, whole small fish, milk ... are rather balanced and people can live on them. The actual populations that don't do farming DO eat a lot of those kinds of foods, plus greens and berries and seaweed. Humans are big time omnivores, always have been! There is a really interesting article about this:

http://news.harvard.edu/gazette/story/2008/12/of-neanderthals-and-dairy-farmers/

BTW someone asked me privately what "BAS" stands for. It's our official term :-) for what sounds to me like a great lunch: Rick's "Big A$$ Salad". I can only imagine what is in his, but if it was mine, it would be a big pile of: lettuce, artichoke hearts, olives, roasted nuts, dried cranberries, bacon, tomatoes, chopped fresh herbs ... tossed with a mixture of fresh-pressed garlic, vinegar, and olive oil.

On Tue, Jun 29, 2010 at 6:19 AM, RickS <rstewart@iaff.org> wrote:

Thanks for taking the time to write all of that out.  I have noticed that I lose weight faster when I eat BASs with balsamic vinegar.

There is more to the story about the sailors though that doesn't usually get told.  For centuries the English provided jerky as the staple food on their ships.  Sailors got on just fine eating jerky and fresh water.  As a cost cutting measure they decided to stop providing jerky and start providing bread and fresh water.  Sailors began getting scurvy.  Surgeon James Lind found that adding lemons and limes to their diet kept the incidence of scurvy down and since bread and citrus were still cheaper than jerkey, sailors got to eat bread and limes.  Many phrases came from this period like, "Man cannot live by bread alone", "Scurvy dogs", and our referring to the English as "Limeys".  So the citrus was really a bandaid for poor nutrition brought about by financial decisions to get rid of meat and institute bread instead.

American Indians would go on hunts for weeks or months and eat Pemmican, which is mammal fat mixed with ground dried meat, with no adverse effects.  I think there's something in grains that increases our requirements for vitamins and minerals.  Something to do with phytates.  I'm currently researching all of this now but I don't know enough to go into detail.

-Rick



 
  

 

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[fast5] Re: Vegetarian/Vegan???

have you tried the GAPS diet? you might be able to handle raw dairy after doing this diet.

--- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, "tamaratornado" <tamaratornado@...> wrote:
>
> Now that I have mouthed-off, I have to admit that if I were in my teens or twenties, and I hadn't had the health problems I've had, and I hadn't done the research on nutrition that I have, I'd probably be a vegan. In fact, I am sure I would. I get it's appeal.
>
> When I was in my twenties, macrobiotics was the popular diet, that's what I did. Before I did macrobiotics my diet was horrible, huge amounts of sugar; so it was a big improvement.
>
> Last night my friend who eats similar to me, joked that she was a vegan who eats meat. I actually like a lot of vegan food. We avoid dairy. I love dairy, but it makes me feel bad. I had some high hopes for raw dairy, but it still makes me feel bad.
>

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[fast5] Re: Water and hunger

Thanks for taking the time to write all of that out. I have noticed that I lose weight faster when I eat BASs with balsamic vinegar.

There is more to the story about the sailors though that doesn't usually get told. For centuries the English provided jerky as the staple food on their ships. Sailors got on just fine eating jerky and fresh water. As a cost cutting measure they decided to stop providing jerky and start providing bread and fresh water. Sailors began getting scurvy. Surgeon James Lind found that adding lemons and limes to their diet kept the incidence of scurvy down and since bread and citrus were still cheaper than jerkey, sailors got to eat bread and limes. Many phrases came from this period like, "Man cannot live by bread alone", "Scurvy dogs", and our referring to the English as "Limeys". So the citrus was really a bandaid for poor nutrition brought about by financial decisions to get rid of meat and institute bread instead.

American Indians would go on hunts for weeks or months and eat Pemmican, which is mammal fat mixed with ground dried meat, with no adverse effects. I think there's something in grains that increases our requirements for vitamins and minerals. Something to do with phytates. I'm currently researching all of this now but I don't know enough to go into detail.

-Rick

--- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, Heather Twist <HeatherTwist@...> wrote:
>
> The BAS contains polysaccarides. Polysaccarides are "sort of" digestible ...
> that is, your body doesn't actually use them directly, but they feed the
> bacteria in your lower gut. Those bacteria produce butyrate which does 2
> things: 1) Kills colon cancer cells and 2) Nourishes the gut cells (they
> prefer butyrate for fuel).
>
> The only way to get butyrate to the lower gut is to eat polysaccharides. It
> *can* be produced from fat, notably butter, but normally the fat is absorbed
> before it gets to the lower gut. And if you eat butyrate ... it's in some
> foods, but it stinks ... then it gets absorbed in the upper gut and doesn't
> reach the colon.
>
> So the best way to get butyrate is to eat polysaccharides. Polys also change
> motility and absorption in the gut, so food gets absorbed over a longer
> stretch of the gut, which means it might get absorbed better and it's easier
> on the gut (and you stay full longer). Polys can also chelate heavy metals
> and various toxins.
>
> Salads also typically have vinegar on them: the acetate in vinegar affects
> digestion a lot. I don't know exactly why: in studies they find it makes a
> big difference, but they only guess at the mechanism. Cider vinegar has
> malate and acetate, and both of them are substances used a lot in the body
> and affect metabolism.
>
> As for minerals that are in salad and not in meat: the one that comes to
> mind the most is potassium. There is potassium in meat too, but the meat
> usually contains a fair bit of sodium, and not all that much potassium. I'm
> not all that much up on the exact mineral contents of the various foods
> these days though. I DO know that I operate a whole lot better when I get
> vegies. There are hundreds of compounds in vegetables that aren't in meat,
> and there really isn't a culture in existence that eats ONLY meat. The
> sailors tried that and got scurvy. They might have been able to get away
> with it if they had eaten raw meat or more organ meats, but the Inuit who
> are said to be "only" meat eaters, actually ate a lot of raw fish, whole:
> and fish guts contain vegetable matter from seaweed and plankton. The plains
> Indians ate buffalo a lot, but they also apparently loved buffalo guts (full
> of half-digested grass) and gathered many kinds of wild vegies and fruits.
>
> The reverse is true too, of course: there is no culture that eats ONLY
> vegetable matter, and feeding a child a purely vegan diet ruins brain
> development. The healthiest peoples on earth seem to eat a combination of
> seafood/eggs/poultry/pork/milk/beef (in that order, roughly) and various
> plant materials, including rice and beans. The most unhealthy cultures
> appear to be the ones that rely on wheat/beef/sugar/certain oils for most
> of their calories.

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Re: [fast5] Re: Water and hunger

Apple cider vinegar contains potassium.  So if you add a little to your ACV and water beverage it will be okay.  Just don't use a lot of baking soda all the time every day as it can cause other issues.
.

-----Original Message-----
From: Heather Twist <HeatherTwist@gmail.com>
To: fast5@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Sun, Jun 27, 2010 5:59 pm
Subject: Re: [fast5] Re: Water and hunger

 

I use just enough soda to balance the vinegar, so maybe half a tsp? I'm not sure why soda would be bad, except maybe it dilutes stomach acid. It wouldn't do that mixed with vinegar though. And of course soda increases sodium, which some people try to avoid.

My own sodium level tends to be low, which might be why I crave it sometimes. Sodium should be balanced by potassium, and I'm not sure if I get enough of that either. I've been increasing the number of vegies I eat though.

That is one of the issues I have seen on the super-low-carb diets. I think people do need vegetables, esp. greens. The vegies have the polysaccharides and vitamins and some minerals that meat just doesn't have. Giving up your Big A$$ salad makes for less hydration, but it also affects your gut flora, which can affect your appetite too.

On Sat, Jun 26, 2010 at 4:15 AM, RickS <rstewart@iaff.org> wrote:

Hi Heather, sorry I didn't read your post before posting mine.  I loves me some salt.  :)  I put it on just about everything!  Neat idea about the baking soda for fizziness.  But I have read that ingesting too much baking soda can be bad too.  How much do you use?

-Rick


---  

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Re: [fast5] Meat & ferritin Re: Dr. Serrano on vegan diets.

Yeah I’ve always been on the way low end. And was before I started that raw thing I mentioned. So it probably didn’t take long for me to get way way wayyyyy low.

I’m sure that this is something that is slowly getting better as I get better and better at the way I eat now. I think its easy for me to drift into the too low zone though, something I’m probably always going to have to consciously work to avoid, just due to my natural lifelong habits....(of eating very little, etc.)
chantelle


On 6/28/10 1:10 PM, "Heather Twist" <HeatherTwist@gmail.com> wrote:

 
 
   

Ferritin is a measure of the total stored iron in the body. The "loose" iron in the blood isn't a very good measure, because it goes up and down, like blood sugar does. But stored iron changes more slowly.

Have you ever done gardening? If you grow plants, you know about the problems with fertilizer. If you don't add enough fertilizer, the plants get yellow and die. If you put in too much fertilizer, the plants get yellow and die. If you put in JUST ENOUGH fertilizer, you get big healthy green plants.

(same thing goes for water!).

Iron is like that, in our diet. There is a very specific balance that the body needs. In the US, people appear to be getting way too much, partly because we eat a fair bit of meat and saturated fat and pop (all of which promote iron absorption), plus many foods have LOTS of added iron. So the iron-overload diseases are proliferating, and the base ferritin level tends to be high in many people.

Going vegetarian gives you way too little, but it takes some time for the iron levels to get low, and in the meantime, a person with overload will feel better. In most of the world, people tend to be anemic: because they don't eat much meat and often they have parasites, and they don't have iron-enriched food.

So think fertilizer: you don't want too much. You don't want too little.



On Mon, Jun 28, 2010 at 4:07 AM, tamaratornado <tamaratornado@yahoo.com> wrote:

Yes, he is working for a meat company. I like this company's newsletters.

I don't understand about ferritin. It's a type of iron? When I was younger, and vegetarian, I became anemic. Now that I am older, I have to worry about too much iron? It's confusing to me. Does that mean that younger women should eat more meat and older women less?

Some (many?) hunter-gatherer cultures ate large amounts of meat.



 
> > 

   

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Re: [fast5] Meat & ferritin Re: Dr. Serrano on vegan diets.

Ferritin is a measure of the total stored iron in the body. The "loose" iron in the blood isn't a very good measure, because it goes up and down, like blood sugar does. But stored iron changes more slowly.

Have you ever done gardening? If you grow plants, you know about the problems with fertilizer. If you don't add enough fertilizer, the plants get yellow and die. If you put in too much fertilizer, the plants get yellow and die. If you put in JUST ENOUGH fertilizer, you get big healthy green plants.

(same thing goes for water!).

Iron is like that, in our diet. There is a very specific balance that the body needs. In the US, people appear to be getting way too much, partly because we eat a fair bit of meat and saturated fat and pop (all of which promote iron absorption), plus many foods have LOTS of added iron. So the iron-overload diseases are proliferating, and the base ferritin level tends to be high in many people.

Going vegetarian gives you way too little, but it takes some time for the iron levels to get low, and in the meantime, a person with overload will feel better. In most of the world, people tend to be anemic: because they don't eat much meat and often they have parasites, and they don't have iron-enriched food.

So think fertilizer: you don't want too much. You don't want too little.

On Mon, Jun 28, 2010 at 4:07 AM, tamaratornado <tamaratornado@yahoo.com> wrote:

Yes, he is working for a meat company. I like this company's newsletters.

I don't understand about ferritin. It's a type of iron? When I was younger, and vegetarian, I became anemic. Now that I am older, I have to worry about too much iron? It's confusing to me. Does that mean that younger women should eat more meat and older women less?

Some (many?) hunter-gatherer cultures ate large amounts of meat.



 
> > 

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Re: [fast5] Re: Water and hunger

The BAS contains polysaccarides. Polysaccarides are "sort of" digestible ... that is, your body doesn't actually use them directly, but they feed the bacteria in your lower gut. Those bacteria produce butyrate which does 2 things: 1) Kills colon cancer cells and 2) Nourishes the gut cells (they prefer butyrate for fuel).

The only way to get butyrate to the lower gut is to eat polysaccharides. It *can* be produced from fat, notably butter, but normally the fat is absorbed before it gets to the lower gut. And if you eat butyrate ... it's in some foods, but it stinks ... then it gets absorbed in the upper gut and doesn't reach the colon.

So the best way to get butyrate is to eat polysaccharides. Polys also change motility and absorption in the gut, so food gets absorbed over a longer stretch of the gut, which means it might get absorbed better and it's easier on the gut (and you stay full longer). Polys can also chelate heavy metals and various toxins.

Salads also typically have vinegar on them: the acetate in vinegar affects digestion a lot. I don't know exactly why: in studies they find it makes a big difference, but they only guess at the mechanism. Cider vinegar has malate and acetate, and both of them are substances used a lot in the body and affect metabolism.

As for minerals that are in salad and not in meat: the one that comes to mind the most is potassium. There is potassium in meat too, but the meat usually contains a fair bit of sodium,  and not all that much potassium. I'm not all that much up on the exact mineral contents of the various foods these days though. I DO know that I operate a whole lot better when I get vegies. There are hundreds of compounds in vegetables that aren't in meat, and there really isn't a culture in existence that eats ONLY meat. The sailors tried that and got scurvy. They might have been able to get away with it if they had eaten raw meat or more organ meats, but the Inuit who are said to be "only" meat eaters, actually ate a lot of raw fish, whole: and fish guts contain vegetable matter from seaweed and plankton. The plains Indians ate buffalo a lot, but they also apparently loved buffalo guts (full of half-digested grass) and gathered many kinds of wild vegies and fruits.

The reverse is true too, of course: there is no culture that eats ONLY vegetable matter, and feeding a child a purely vegan diet ruins brain development. The healthiest peoples on earth seem to eat a combination of seafood/eggs/poultry/pork/milk/beef (in that order, roughly) and various plant materials, including rice and beans. The most unhealthy cultures appear to be the ones that rely on wheat/beef/sugar/certain oils  for most of their calories.

On Mon, Jun 28, 2010 at 5:14 AM, RickS <rstewart@iaff.org> wrote:

I can't find the article now but I believe that yes, it can dilute stomach acid.  Good point about the vinegar.  I just gave up shampoo  and conditioner and started washing my hair with baking soda followed by a conditioner of apple cider vinegar.  The idea is that you shouldn't put any chemicals ON your body that you wouldn't put IN your body.  So far so good.  ;)

How does giving up the BAS change my gut flora?

-Rick


 

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[fast5] Re: Water and hunger

what minerals do veggies have that meat doesn't?

--- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, Heather Twist <HeatherTwist@...> wrote:
>
> I use just enough soda to balance the vinegar, so maybe half a tsp? I'm not
> sure why soda would be bad, except maybe it dilutes stomach acid. It
> wouldn't do that mixed with vinegar though. And of course soda increases
> sodium, which some people try to avoid.
>
> My own sodium level tends to be low, which might be why I crave it
> sometimes. Sodium should be balanced by potassium, and I'm not sure if I get
> enough of that either. I've been increasing the number of vegies I eat
> though.
>
> That is one of the issues I have seen on the super-low-carb diets. I think
> people do need vegetables, esp. greens. The vegies have the polysaccharides
> and vitamins and some minerals that meat just doesn't have. Giving up your
> Big A$$ salad makes for less hydration, but it also affects your gut flora,
> which can affect your appetite too.
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jun 26, 2010 at 4:15 AM, RickS <rstewart@...> wrote:
>
> > Hi Heather, sorry I didn't read your post before posting mine. I loves me
> > some salt. :) I put it on just about everything! Neat idea about the
> > baking soda for fizziness. But I have read that ingesting too much baking
> > soda can be bad too. How much do you use?
> >
> > -Rick
> >
> >
> > ---
>

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Re: [fast5] Re: Vegetarian/Vegan???

I never liked dairy and raw dairy has been a total amazing thing for me. I love reading what everybody does.

I did try the all raw no meat thing (which I guess is similar to vegan, but raw) and I gave it a good long haul too. This was before I knew about WAPF, so if I had known about that I never would have tried it.

I guess the good thing in the long run about the fact that I did do that, is that I can speak from personal experience about it.

I can tell you the theory of the old “all raw” folks on b12, but I don’t buy it...... I can just tell you what they thnk.....
I don’t supplement at all though and never have.
Chantelle


On 6/28/10 5:12 AM, "tamaratornado" <tamaratornado@yahoo.com> wrote:

 
 
   

Now that I have mouthed-off, I have to admit that if I were in my teens or twenties, and I hadn't had the health problems I've had, and I hadn't done the research on nutrition that I have, I'd probably be a vegan. In fact, I am sure I would. I get it's appeal.

When I was in my twenties, macrobiotics was the popular diet, that's what I did. Before I did macrobiotics my diet was horrible, huge amounts of sugar; so it was a big improvement.

Last night my friend who eats similar to me, joked that she was a vegan who eats meat. I actually like a lot of vegan food. We avoid dairy. I love dairy, but it makes me feel bad. I had some high hopes for raw dairy, but it still makes me feel bad.

- T

--- In fast5@yahoogroups.com <mailto:fast5%40yahoogroups.com> , "tamaratornado" <tamaratornado@...> wrote:
>
> And what do vegans do for vitamin B12? There is no vegan source.
>
> Almost all of the vegans I know are in their teens and twenties. One reason is that when you are that young, you can get away with a bad diet longer, without noticing it.
>
> If you care about animals. then buy from small farmers.
>
>  - T
>
> --- In fast5@yahoogroups.com <mailto:fast5%40yahoogroups.com> , "tamaratornado" <tamaratornado@> wrote:
> >
> > I have asked vegans, what is their arguments against eggs and dairy raised by small farmers who care for their animals? They never have an answer for me.
> >
> > No human culture has ever been vegan. Every tradtional culture has had some form of animal food in their diet, be it eggs or dairy or insects, though usually meat and fish. There have been very few vegetarian cultures worldwide.
> >
> > Keep eating eggs and don't feel bad about it. Try to get your eggs from local organic farmers if you can.
> >
> >  - T
> >
> > --- In fast5@yahoogroups.com <mailto:fast5%40yahoogroups.com> , Niki Barker <nicollbarker@> wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi
> > >
> > >  
> > >
> > > I'm vegetarian, sometime struggling type of Vegan.  Just can't always resist cheese and chocolate! I do also eat free range eggs so I guess I am really only a vegetarian but trying to be vegan.
> > >
> > >  
> > >
> > > I don't find the Fast5 hard, I have had some hard times, for example I started eating badly, just ganniting junk food and then I have trouble lasting the next day until my eating window again.  I'm pretty much back on track now and find if I feel hungry it's normally thirst so I find black coffee or green tea gets rid of it.
> > >
> > >  
> > >
> > > My diet isn't brilliant but I always break my fast with a few pieces of fruit and a small bowl of nuts.  I do eat load of veggies too but do snack on crisp breads and peanut butter or rice cakes and the odd bar of chocolate, bag of crisps.  I'm pretty sure I eat too much in my window but I'm lucky enough that at the moment I'm only trying to maintain my weight as I don't need to lose any and I'm continuing to do that on Fast5.
> > >
> > >  
> > >
> > > I do quite a bit of exercise, mostly in the form of walking, I walked 18 miles last sunday on only a bottle of water and 2 cups of coffee and survived without any problems!  I'm doing a 25 mile walk tomorrow and the temperature is supposed to be over 30degrees so will have to drink more fluids.  I will take a banana or something with me in case I do feel faint and/or weak but hope not to need it.
> > >
> > >  
> > >
> > > Anyway, what I'm trying to say in a rambling roundabout sort of way, is that I haven't found it hard doing Fast5 as a vegetarian but do eat lots of nuts for my protein.
> > >
> > >  
> > >
> > > Niki
> > >  
> > >
> > >
> > > To: fast5@yahoogroups.com <mailto:fast5%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > From: guygiard@
> > > Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2010 15:48:22 +0000
> > > Subject: [fast5] Vegetarian/Vegan???
> > >
> > >   
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Hello again everyone
> > >
> > > I'm new to this Fast-5 method and intrigued, it goes against so much the grain!!!! But I do water fasting so I'm used to go against the accepted ideas.
> > >
> > > So my question is would such a program be compatable with a vegetarian/vegan diet
> > >
> > > I'm asking since it seems to mean a big diminution of calorie intakes which my eating habits already entails.
> > >
> > > So are there any Vegans / Vegetarians here on this group who can share their experiences?
> > >
> > > Thanks a million
> > >
> > > Guy
> > >
> >
>

 
   

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[fast5] Re: Water and hunger

I can't find the article now but I believe that yes, it can dilute stomach acid. Good point about the vinegar. I just gave up shampoo and conditioner and started washing my hair with baking soda followed by a conditioner of apple cider vinegar. The idea is that you shouldn't put any chemicals ON your body that you wouldn't put IN your body. So far so good. ;)

How does giving up the BAS change my gut flora?

-Rick

--- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, Heather Twist <HeatherTwist@...> wrote:
>
> I use just enough soda to balance the vinegar, so maybe half a tsp? I'm not
> sure why soda would be bad, except maybe it dilutes stomach acid. It
> wouldn't do that mixed with vinegar though. And of course soda increases
> sodium, which some people try to avoid.
>
> My own sodium level tends to be low, which might be why I crave it
> sometimes. Sodium should be balanced by potassium, and I'm not sure if I get
> enough of that either. I've been increasing the number of vegies I eat
> though.
>
> That is one of the issues I have seen on the super-low-carb diets. I think
> people do need vegetables, esp. greens. The vegies have the polysaccharides
> and vitamins and some minerals that meat just doesn't have. Giving up your
> Big A$$ salad makes for less hydration, but it also affects your gut flora,
> which can affect your appetite too.

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[fast5] Re: Vegetarian/Vegan???

Now that I have mouthed-off, I have to admit that if I were in my teens or twenties, and I hadn't had the health problems I've had, and I hadn't done the research on nutrition that I have, I'd probably be a vegan. In fact, I am sure I would. I get it's appeal.

When I was in my twenties, macrobiotics was the popular diet, that's what I did. Before I did macrobiotics my diet was horrible, huge amounts of sugar; so it was a big improvement.

Last night my friend who eats similar to me, joked that she was a vegan who eats meat. I actually like a lot of vegan food. We avoid dairy. I love dairy, but it makes me feel bad. I had some high hopes for raw dairy, but it still makes me feel bad.

- T

--- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, "tamaratornado" <tamaratornado@...> wrote:
>
> And what do vegans do for vitamin B12? There is no vegan source.
>
> Almost all of the vegans I know are in their teens and twenties. One reason is that when you are that young, you can get away with a bad diet longer, without noticing it.
>
> If you care about animals. then buy from small farmers.
>
> - T
>
> --- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, "tamaratornado" <tamaratornado@> wrote:
> >
> > I have asked vegans, what is their arguments against eggs and dairy raised by small farmers who care for their animals? They never have an answer for me.
> >
> > No human culture has ever been vegan. Every tradtional culture has had some form of animal food in their diet, be it eggs or dairy or insects, though usually meat and fish. There have been very few vegetarian cultures worldwide.
> >
> > Keep eating eggs and don't feel bad about it. Try to get your eggs from local organic farmers if you can.
> >
> > - T
> >
> > --- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, Niki Barker <nicollbarker@> wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > Hi
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > I'm vegetarian, sometime struggling type of Vegan. Just can't always resist cheese and chocolate! I do also eat free range eggs so I guess I am really only a vegetarian but trying to be vegan.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > I don't find the Fast5 hard, I have had some hard times, for example I started eating badly, just ganniting junk food and then I have trouble lasting the next day until my eating window again. I'm pretty much back on track now and find if I feel hungry it's normally thirst so I find black coffee or green tea gets rid of it.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > My diet isn't brilliant but I always break my fast with a few pieces of fruit and a small bowl of nuts. I do eat load of veggies too but do snack on crisp breads and peanut butter or rice cakes and the odd bar of chocolate, bag of crisps. I'm pretty sure I eat too much in my window but I'm lucky enough that at the moment I'm only trying to maintain my weight as I don't need to lose any and I'm continuing to do that on Fast5.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > I do quite a bit of exercise, mostly in the form of walking, I walked 18 miles last sunday on only a bottle of water and 2 cups of coffee and survived without any problems! I'm doing a 25 mile walk tomorrow and the temperature is supposed to be over 30degrees so will have to drink more fluids. I will take a banana or something with me in case I do feel faint and/or weak but hope not to need it.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Anyway, what I'm trying to say in a rambling roundabout sort of way, is that I haven't found it hard doing Fast5 as a vegetarian but do eat lots of nuts for my protein.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Niki
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > To: fast5@yahoogroups.com
> > > From: guygiard@
> > > Date: Thu, 24 Jun 2010 15:48:22 +0000
> > > Subject: [fast5] Vegetarian/Vegan???
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Hello again everyone
> > >
> > > I'm new to this Fast-5 method and intrigued, it goes against so much the grain!!!! But I do water fasting so I'm used to go against the accepted ideas.
> > >
> > > So my question is would such a program be compatable with a vegetarian/vegan diet
> > >
> > > I'm asking since it seems to mean a big diminution of calorie intakes which my eating habits already entails.
> > >
> > > So are there any Vegans / Vegetarians here on this group who can share their experiences?
> > >
> > > Thanks a million
> > >
> > > Guy
> > >
> >
>

------------------------------------

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[fast5] Meat & ferritin Re: Dr. Serrano on vegan diets.

Yes, he is working for a meat company. I like this company's newsletters.

I don't understand about ferritin. It's a type of iron? When I was younger, and vegetarian, I became anemic. Now that I am older, I have to worry about too much iron? It's confusing to me. Does that mean that younger women should eat more meat and older women less?

Some (many?) hunter-gatherer cultures ate large amounts of meat.

--- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, Heather Twist <HeatherTwist@...> wrote:
>
> "Dr. Eric Serrano M.D.
> With advanced degrees in nutrition, kinesiology and wellness
> 475 North Hill Road
> Pickerington, OH 43147-1157
>
> EMAIL QUESTIONS TO: eathealthy@... "
>
>
>
> It looks like Dr. Serrano is consulting for a meat seller? Not that his
> answer isn't a good one, just that it cuts into his credibility some.
>
> I'm still waiting for *someone* to start talking about the high ferritin
> levels that can (in some people) be caused by eating meat, grass-fed or
> otherwise. I don't think this means one shouldn't eat meat, because the heme
> iron can be blocked by taking calcium at the same meal for those people, but
> it might account for why some people feel so much better on a vegan diet.
>
>
> On Sun, Jun 27, 2010 at 6:30 AM, tamaratornado <tamaratornado@...>wrote:
>
> > Dr. Eric Serrano M.D., M.S., B.C.
> >
> > Dear Dr. Serrano,
> >
> > I live in North Palm Beach, FL. I am a young mom of two preteens and have
> > a die-hard, meat-eating husband. We are in a whirlwind of disagreement since
> > I just spent a week in a "raw food" health institute in West Palm Beach
> > where I learned the "detriments" of meat eating which leads to degeneration,
> > as they taught. We ate vegan raw food the entire time there, and my friend
> > dropped 50 points in her cholesterol in 3 weeks. She also became somewhat
> > anemic. I personally had no adverse effects, and lost 5 lbs in one week. I
> > weigh 110 and am 5'6", so that was a lot for me.
> >
> > In light of learning of all the recommendations leading to avoiding read
> > meat for consumption, as well as ethical reasons, I started to eat
> > vegetarian when I came home from the stay. I viewed one too many PETA videos
> > of factory farming and abuse and my stomach turned.
> >
> > So, I have been eating vegan these past two months, with no problems, and
> > my family is very upset. They don't want to join me. This has gone on for
> > two months now. I found U.S. Wellness Meats and read about the farm,
> > grass-fed beef, etc, and now am awaiting an order of meat from John, who
> > spoke with me recently. I'm grateful he has healthier food than conventional
> > beef! (I sent the info out to all my meat eating friends.) I figured that if
> > my beautiful family insists upon eating meat, I will at least get them
> > healthy meat. But I still feel as though I am buying them clogged arteries
> > and high cholesterol. Can you tell me how this may be wrong? Can proper
> > omegas and CLA's be gotten from Fish Oil?
> >
> > Where in all this does cholesterol and heart disease come in? Why does the
> > book "The China Study" have such great implication and strong, researched
> > argument against meat eating if it is really safe? Who is right? What
> > gives?
> >
> > I would like to know the truth and eat what is healthy! I truly appreciate
> > your help! Thanks for your time!
> >
> > Eagerly awaiting your response,
> >
> > Lisa
> > ______________________________________________
> >
> > Dear Lisa,
> >
> > I am very familiar with the Raw Institute, even though I have not been
> > there myself. I will try to answer your questions without letting you know
> > I dislike the vegan diet.
> >
> > Your friend losing 50 points of cholesterol doesn't mean a thing.
> > Cholesterol is the most important antioxidant in the body but it is a great
> > selling point for the pharmaceutical industry. Cholesterol is the mother of
> > 90% of your hormones and also it is in every cell in your body. Do you know
> > that your body makes 60% of your cholesterol? Did you know that your brain,
> > if you pull the water off, is almost all fat?
> > Did you know that if your cholesterol is less than 155 after 55 or 60 the
> > chances of dying of cancer or suicide increases by 3000%?
> >
> > Cholesterol lowering doesn't mean a thing unless you have extreme numbers
> > and that is your body telling you something is going on. Did you know that
> > if your cholesterol is high, it may mean that your hormones are low, and
> > because it has to produce more hormones it has to dump more cholesterol into
> > the blood so it can make the hormones necessary to be alive? Did you know
> > that normal cholesterol levels 10 years ago were 250 and now the doctors
> > want to lower that number to 150?
> >
> > If the body was really made to only eat vegetables, which I can tell you it
> > is not, then we wouldn't make a hormone or an enzyme called elastin. Only
> > carnivores produce this enzyme hormone, and guess what, humans do. Now if
> > you go back to prehistoric era, you have never seen a man building a garden,
> > but there is plenty of evidence they used to kill or cut so they could eat.
> > The reason they needed meat and skin was to protect themselves from the
> > elements and other animals. Agriculture didn't exist until the Egyptians
> > took over the world. They could feed people in one place due to
> > agriculture, but before that time we were mostly nomads, meaning we moved
> > with the food and the seasons. Yes, we ate vegetables, fruits and nuts, but
> > we never stopped hunting to grow vegetables. The best way to really follow
> > vegetarians, is by following a culture that is pure vegetarian, and we still
> > haven't found one, and the closest one is the people from India and they are
> > not pure vegans.
> >
> > Your body requires B12, vitamin D and other natural sources of necessary or
> > essential nutrients that are provided by meat or fish, and sorry, but
> > vegetables will not give you any of those nutrients. Also, where are you
> > going to get the fat that you require to be alive? I would like to know how
> > much energy, and sex drive you have in 6 months, please let us know.
> >
> > The problem is the quality of the meat, and not the meat itself. If I give
> > poison to my meat, what do you think you are eating? If you find a dead
> > animal that was poisoned with a lethal dose and you eat it, you are going to
> > get sick, this of course is an extreme but that is what we are doing with
> > our children when we eat the commercially grown meats and non-organic
> > vegetables. Also, where are your vegetables coming from? Are they from a
> > hydro farm, are they fresh, who picked the vegetables, what type of soil was
> > used? Did they use artificial fertilizers, and who touched them before you
> > ate them?
> >
> > We have to eat fish, meat or eggs so we can survive, if not you will get
> > sick, trust me.
> >
> > Thank You,
> >
> > Dr. Serrano
> >
> >
> >
> > _____________________________________________________________________________________
> >
> > This is a friendly reminder to email health and wellness questions to the
> > email address below for Dr. Eric Serrano M.D. question and answer series.
> > Please place Dr. Serrano's name in the subject line for quicker processing.
> >
> > Answers will appear in future issues of the Newsletter and News Alert. Your
> > full name will not be displayed. Dr. Serrano has been so kind to offer his
> > expertise to literally any question related to health and wellness involving
> > grass-fed meats.
> >
> > Dr. Serrano has a wealth of knowledge from both his farm background, 15
> > years of clinical experience and an award-winning professor at Ohio State
> > Medical School. Dr. Serrano has an outstanding family practice on the
> > outskirts of Columbus, Ohio and works with a select group of professional
> > athletes.
> >
> > Dr. Eric Serrano M.D.
> > With advanced degrees in nutrition, kinesiology and wellness
> > 475 North Hill Road
> > Pickerington, OH 43147-1157
> >
> > EMAIL QUESTIONS TO: eathealthy@...
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
>
>
> --
>

------------------------------------

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