Fast-5 Diet and Lifestyle: February 2010

Sunday, February 28, 2010

Re: [fast5] (Phil: muscles, protein)

What kind of meat? I ask this because I've been studying the effects of heme iron on blood sugar, and the results are pretty interesting. Even though you would not think "meat" affects blood glucose, iron does in fact affect blood sugar in ways that have been documented for some time, although I haven't seen a good explanation of why this is so. The amount of available iron varies wildly between foods, and also depends on what *else* you consume in the same meal.

Anyway, a good experiment would be to try a meal that uses *fish* or *whey* for protein ... either one has low iron availability, but plenty of protein. If you blood glucose still rises, then the protein might be the issue. But if it only rises with beef, then it might be the heme iron.

On Sun, Feb 28, 2010 at 11:00 PM, Karen <laurvick@charter.net> wrote:

Thanks for this input, Phil.

I think part of my situation is my blood sugar.

I did not know I had a problem until last September.

In mid-August, I changed my WOE to high fat, low carb and moderate protein.

My protein intake now is about 60g where previously, i was consuming 100-150gP.

Perhaps if i try to have more fat (but this mean more calories...) with my Protein, i can have MORE protein...

but i had 4 oz of meat for one meal and my BS spiked.

I just don't know how to eat as much protein as i feel i'd need to eat along with enough fat to stabilize blood sugar within the 5-hr window...

(apologies. for some reason, i can't 'snip' Phil's post...)

F

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RE: [fast5] (Phil: muscles, protein)

Thanks for this input, Phil.

I think part of my situation is my blood sugar.

I did not know I had a problem until last September.

In mid-August, I changed my WOE to high fat, low carb and moderate protein.

My protein intake now is about 60g where previously, i was consuming 100-150gP.

Perhaps if i try to have more fat (but this mean more calories...) with my Protein, i can have MORE protein...

but i had 4 oz of meat for one meal and my BS spiked.

I just don't know how to eat as much protein as i feel i'd need to eat along with enough fat to stabilize blood sugar within the 5-hr window...

(apologies. for some reason, i can't 'snip' Phil's post...)

From: fast5@yahoogroups.com [mailto:fast5@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Phil Voelker
Sent: Sunday, February 28, 2010 10:39 PM
To: fast5@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [fast5] Fast5 and P90X (Heather: muscles, protein)

Hola,

Heather - you rock! Thanks for the extra stuff on this. :-)

Karen, I can tell you that I actually feel like I'm getting stronger. I would submit though that my weight training is a little different than a lot of folks.

A while back (about a year or so ago) I read this article in Men's Health about muscle building. It was an article about these NASA scientists that studied muscle growth for 30 years for the space program, to address things like muscle atrophy in zero gravity, yada yada. . . .Anyhoo, the gist of the article was that their research indicated that the most efficient way to build muscle was not to do the typical weightlifting regimen (usually 3 or 4 days on, one day off, hitting opposite body parts in each lift), but instead to do a full body lift routine every other day. Their research approached the muscles in the body as one unit; when you work one body part you can't ever "isolate" it -- the whole body is involved. Once you do a hard lift, you put the whole body in a repair / growth phase for about 48 hours. If you lift the very next day it sort of puts the muscle-building back to square one. Very interesting article.

I've found that by doing a full body lift every other day (and cardio probably 6 days a week) and eating high-protein/low sugar, I do feel that I'm getting stronger and leaner. I overfeed a little after my weight training, and actually try to underfeed a little on the off/cardio days. I wouldn't offer it as a scientific experiment, but it's an armchair analysis in progress. :-)

--- On Sun, 2/28/10, Karen <laurvick@charter.net> wrote:

From: Karen <laurvick@charter.net>
Subject: RE: [fast5] Fast5 and P90X (Heather: muscles, protein)
To: fast5@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sunday, February 28, 2010, 11:18 PM

Heather wrote (and wisely so....):

>>My take on this is that muscle mass is in fact influenced by how often you eat, plus how much protein. Just like the body builder magazines say. But that is NOT related to either health or "fitness".<<

So I'm trying to figure out why, even tho I continue to lift weights, I've lost muscle tone and now I'm noticing my lifts are not as 'heavy' as they used to be (indicating to me I'm losing strength)...

I LIKE the look of muscle. but i don't want muscle at the expense of health. And if i was just as strong as i used to be and didn't look muscular, i'd be OK with that (i think.....).

but to feel like i'm losing strength AND to not LOOK muscular is making me mad!

Before I was aware of my blood sugar issues, i would consume about 125g protein/day. Now i'm taking in about 60g.

do I hear you SUGGEST that i can get STRONG and muscular using Fast5 AND eating high(er) protein?

if so, then i need to figure out how to consume more protein and keep my blood sugar stable.

I find that if i eat 4 oz of meat and don't have enough fat w/it, m BS goes up. perhaps the answer is to have more fat...

I also find it difficult to eat as much as i'd 'need' to w/in a 5-hr eating window... As always, looking FWD to others' input...

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RE: [fast5] Fast5 and P90X (Heather: muscles, protein)

Hola,

Heather - you rock! Thanks for the extra stuff on this. :-)

Karen, I can tell you that I actually feel like I'm getting stronger. I would submit though that my weight training is a little different than a lot of folks.

--- On Sun, 2/28/10, Karen <laurvick@charter.net> wrote:

From: Karen <laurvick@charter.net>
Subject: RE: [fast5] Fast5 and P90X (Heather: muscles, protein)
To: fast5@yahoogroups.com
Date: Sunday, February 28, 2010, 11:18 PM

Heather wrote (and wisely so....):

>>My take on this is that muscle mass is in fact influenced by how often you eat, plus how much protein. Just like the body builder magazines say. But that is NOT related to either health or "fitness".<<

So I'm trying to figure out why, even tho I continue to lift weights, I've lost muscle tone and now I'm noticing my lifts are not as 'heavy' as they used to be (indicating to me I'm losing strength)...

I LIKE the look of muscle. but i don't want muscle at the expense of health. And if i was just as strong as i used to be and didn't look muscular, i'd be OK with that (i think.....).

but to feel like i'm losing strength AND to not LOOK muscular is making me mad!

Before I was aware of my blood sugar issues, i would consume about 125g protein/day. Now i'm taking in about 60g.

do I hear you SUGGEST that i can get STRONG and muscular using Fast5 AND eating high(er) protein?

if so, then i need to figure out how to consume more protein and keep my blood sugar stable.

I find that if i eat 4 oz of meat and don't have enough fat w/it, m BS goes up. perhaps the answer is to have more fat...

I also find it difficult to eat as much as i'd 'need' to w/in a 5-hr eating window... As always, looking FWD to others' input...

__._,_.___

__,_._,___

[get this widget]

RE: [fast5] Fast5 and P90X (Heather: muscles, protein)

Heather wrote (and wisely so....):

>>My take on this is that muscle mass is in fact influenced by how often you eat, plus how much protein. Just like the body builder magazines say. But that is NOT related to either health or "fitness".<<

So I'm trying to figure out why, even tho I continue to lift weights, I've lost muscle tone and now I'm noticing my lifts are not as 'heavy' as they used to be (indicating to me I'm losing strength)...

I LIKE the look of muscle. but i don't want muscle at the expense of health. And if i was just as strong as i used to be and didn't look muscular, i'd be OK with that (i think.....).

but to feel like i'm losing strength AND to not LOOK muscular is making me mad!

Before I was aware of my blood sugar issues, i would consume about 125g protein/day. Now i'm taking in about 60g.

do I hear you SUGGEST that i can get STRONG and muscular using Fast5 AND eating high(er) protein?

if so, then i need to figure out how to consume more protein and keep my blood sugar stable.

I find that if i eat 4 oz of meat and don't have enough fat w/it, m BS goes up. perhaps the answer is to have more fat...

I also find it difficult to eat as much as i'd 'need' to w/in a 5-hr eating window... As always, looking FWD to others' input...

__._,_.___

__,_._,___

[get this widget]

Re: [fast5] Fast5 and P90X

The best research I've seen on this to date is in chickens ... specifically meat

chickens, where the amount of food given (and the timing) results in more

muscle, even without exercise. It's an experiment I've done myself: using the

same breed. One batch, all the food they want (high protein). Another batch,

only fed once a day, all they can eat (also high protein).

The first batch gains WAY more muscle (but not fat). However, they are also far less

healthy. The muscle they gain is weak (AKA "tender"). They get sick

easily too, and seem to be prone to heart disease. The second batch

is way skinnier, but they act more like healthy chickens and live longer.

My take on this is that muscle mass is in fact influenced by how often

you eat, plus how much protein. Just like the body builder magazines say.

But that is NOT related to either health or "fitness". The healthiest animals

are insanely strong, but they have little muscle mass. Those skinny chimps

are stronger than the strongest man, but they don't have much muscle

mass. Deer can jump an 8 foot fence on those skinny little legs, too.

It might be that for free weight lifting, having more mass helps for

balance. And having more muscles looks good for competition.

Otherwise, I think "lithe and strong" is a better goal. My opinion

only. Every time I see a body builder I see a meat chicken ...

On Sun, Feb 28, 2010 at 6:14 AM, David Nyman <david@davidnyman.com> wrote:

Very interesting take, Phil. I suppose the critical question would be whether the body can become (i.e. after any whatever transient adaptations are necessary) as efficient at using long-term stored calories, and previously-ingested stores of protein and other anabolic components, as it is presumed to be at exploiting immediately-available gut-contents in the "6-meal-a-day" paradigm. My suspicion would be - e.g. on evolutionary grounds - that it can (I think Dr Herring has commented on aspects of this) and indeed there are some quite proficient bodybuilders out there who have gained substantial muscle on an IF regime, e.g:

http://www.leangains.com/

I suspect the "continuous eating" approach is partly driven by the difficulty of ingesting large amounts of calories within a limited window, and partly because, in the absence of the critical adaptations, the trainer tends to feel weak without a regular energy "fix". Additionally, most men (and it's nearly always men) who want to gain bulk have a very unrealistic idea of just how much of any weight they add is really muscle. Certainly, if you ingest 1000s of extra calories per day in pursuit of a "bulking" phase you will gain lots of pounds and inches, but as physique competitors who subsequently have to "cut" down to the very low body-fat levels required for elite competition discover, the vast majority of the poundage gained in this way turns out to have been fat, not muscle.

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[fast5] Re: For Bert - Amino acid supplementation

Q. Does ingestion of amino acids (AAs) derail fat burning?

Since protein is hydrolyzed (broken apart) into AAs by stomach acid, once the stuff is past your stomach, it's pretty much the same whether you take it in as protein or AAs. A protein meal will increase insulin and decrease circulating fatty acids, diminishing fat usage. (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC292827/?page=1). Consuming only a single AA may change this somewhat, but the responses to individual AAs I've read are similar.

One of the leading theories regarding how calorie restriction works to extend longevity is that without the surplus intake, the body is forced to recycle cells and their components, including proteins. When it recycles the proteins this cleans up cells and breaks them down into their component amino acids (AAs). That supply of AAs is in exact proportion to what the body needs, because they're coming from the proteins it has recently built.

The strongest method for preserving muscle is to use it. The tendency to recycle (autophagy) will be balanced or overwhelmed by demand for new growth.

Since AAs are what protein is made of, I see no reason to augment AA intake if one's diet has adequate protein. Lack of AAs is manifest as lack of protein or generalized malnutrition, which is very rare in developed countries. Supplying disproportionate amounts of individual amino acids seems more likely to cause trouble than prevent it. AAs can be used to supply fuel for the brain via gluconeogenesis, and they do have caloric content of 4 calories per gram.

I'm also a big fan of "if it isn't broken, don't fix it," so if you're seeing good results with your regimen, I wouldn't change. If you want the best chance of achieving the still-not-proven longevity enhancement possibility of IF, then a change might be worth considering.

Best wishes,
Bert

Bert Herring
Fast-5 Corporation

--- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, Phil Voelker <mail4pvoelker@...> wrote:
>
> Â
> Hola, Doc!
> Â
> This question stems from a conversation here about Fast 5 and P90X (the thread is below).Â
> Â
> As you know, I'm no bodybuilder!Â I'm a 42 year old, 6'4" guy who used to weigh well over 400, who is now down to about 225 through diet and exercise.Â Weight training has been, at least for me, the thing that transformed me mentally and physically. Fast 5 has been not only a big part of my transformation, but also an eating plan that I continue to champion.
> Â
> Anyway -- I want to ask about amino acid supplementation.Â Every morning and afternoon, I take in 5-7 grams each of glutamine and branched-chain amino acids, as well as arginine (AAKG) and creatine.Â I have a better understanding on how the aminos are used.Â Glutamine, from what I've read, is not only immediately used as an alternate fuel source for the brain and gut, but also seeme to be regarded as something that helps inhibit cortisol production at its highest regular cycles (like morning and afternoon, for instance).Â I believe I read that over half of your skeletal makeup is glutamine, so supplementing with it can actually keep your body from using muscle for fuel.
> Â
> My question - if amino acids are assimilated rapidly as a "food source," would they derail the fat-burning of a fasting state even if I can't see that they have any calories associated with them?Â At least none of the pure powders that I use have any calories listed on them.
> Â
> I'd love your input.Â I feel like my regimen is really pretty effective for me.Â Â I also supplement with conjugated linoleic acid (CLA) which is basically an oil that does have some calories, but I was more interested in the amino acids themselves.Â
> Â
> Regards,
> Phil
>

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Re: [fast5] For Bert - Amino acid supplementation

This is for Phil Voelker: I don't know anything about P90X, but I do take one so-called amino acid supplement: L-Carnitine. I say "so-called" because my research says it's not a true amino acid, but rather closer in molecular structure to the B vitamine choline. It is an enzyme made by our bodies and found only in red meat (which I almost never eat.) At any rate, I stopped taking L-Carnitine once during this weight loss journey and hit a terrible plateau that lasted until I bought some more. I take 2 grams of acetyl l-carnitine, as sold by PuritansPride.com, every morning on an empty stomach, along with CLA. It seems to work for me. Anecdotal, I realize, but one more data point for you to consider.

Linda in Cowtown

On Sun, Feb 28, 2010 at 9:19 AM, Phil Voelker <mail4pvoelker@yahoo.com> wrote:

Hola, Doc!

This question stems from a conversation here about Fast 5 and P90X (the thread is below).

As you know, I'm no bodybuilder! I'm a 42 year old, 6'4" guy who used to weigh well over 400, who is now down to about 225 through diet and exercise. Weight training has been, at least for me, the thing that transformed me mentally and physically. Fast 5 has been not only a big part of my transformation, but also an eating plan that I continue to champion.

Anyway -- I want to ask about amino acid supplementation. Every morning and afternoon, I take in 5-7 grams each of glutamine and branched-chain amino acids, as well as arginine (AAKG) and creatine. I have a better understanding on how the aminos are used. Glutamine, from what I've read, is not only immediately used as an alternate fuel source for the brain and gut, but also seeme to be regarded as something that helps inhibit cortisol production at its highest regular cycles (like morning and afternoon, for instance). I believe I read that over half of your skeletal makeup is glutamine, so supplementing with it can actually keep your body from using muscle for fuel.

My question - if amino acids are assimilated rapidly as a "food source," would they derail the fat-burning of a fasting state even if I can't see that they have any calories associated with them? At least none of the pure powders that I use have any calories listed on them.

I'd love your input. I feel like my regimen is really pretty effective for me. I also supplement with conjugated linoleic acid (CLA) which is basically an oil that does have some calories, but I was more interested in the amino acids themselves.

Regards,

Phil

__._,_.___

__,_._,___

[get this widget]

[fast5] For Bert - Amino acid supplementation

Hola, Doc!

This question stems from a conversation here about Fast 5 and P90X (the thread is below).

As you know, I'm no bodybuilder! I'm a 42 year old, 6'4" guy who used to weigh well over 400, who is now down to about 225 through diet and exercise. Weight training has been, at least for me, the thing that transformed me mentally and physically. Fast 5 has been not only a big part of my transformation, but also an eating plan that I continue to champion.

Anyway -- I want to ask about amino acid supplementation. Every morning and afternoon, I take in 5-7 grams each of glutamine and branched-chain amino acids, as well as arginine (AAKG) and creatine. I have a better understanding on how the aminos are used. Glutamine, from what I've read, is not only immediately used as an alternate fuel source for the brain and gut, but also seeme to be regarded as something that helps inhibit cortisol production at its highest regular cycles (like morning and afternoon, for instance). I believe I read that over half of your skeletal makeup is glutamine, so supplementing with it can actually keep your body from using muscle for fuel.

My question - if amino acids are assimilated rapidly as a "food source," would they derail the fat-burning of a fasting state even if I can't see that they have any calories associated with them? At least none of the pure powders that I use have any calories listed on them.

I'd love your input. I feel like my regimen is really pretty effective for me. I also supplement with conjugated linoleic acid (CLA) which is basically an oil that does have some calories, but I was more interested in the amino acids themselves.

Regards,

Phil

--- On Sun, 2/28/10, David Nyman <david@davidnyman.com> wrote:

From: David Nyman <david@davidnyman.com>
Subject: Re: [fast5] Fast5 and P90X
To: "fast5" <fast5@yahoogroups.com>
Date: Sunday, February 28, 2010, 7:14 AM

Very interesting take, Phil. I suppose the critical question would be whether the body can become (i.e. after any whatever transient adaptations are necessary) as efficient at using long-term stored calories, and previously-ingested stores of protein and other anabolic components, as it is presumed to be at exploiting immediately- available gut-contents in the "6-meal-a-day" paradigm. My suspicion would be - e.g. on evolutionary grounds - that it can (I think Dr Herring has commented on aspects of this) and indeed there are some quite proficient bodybuilders out there who have gained substantial muscle on an IF regime, e.g:

http://www.leangain s.com/

I suspect the "continuous eating" approach is partly driven by the difficulty of ingesting large amounts of calories within a limited window, and partly because, in the absence of the critical adaptations, the trainer tends to feel weak without a regular energy "fix". Additionally, most men (and it's nearly always men) who want to gain bulk have a very unrealistic idea of just how much of any weight they add is really muscle. Certainly, if you ingest 1000s of extra calories per day in pursuit of a "bulking" phase you will gain lots of pounds and inches, but as physique competitors who subsequently have to "cut" down to the very low body-fat levels required for elite competition discover, the vast majority of the poundage gained in this way turns out to have been fat, not muscle. The "lean-gain" approach short-cuts this "inflationary- deflationary" cycle by using much more modest caloric increments to support the development of the same amount of underlying muscle without concomitant - and unhealthy - gains in fat.

One last point is that I suspect that much of the "lab" research on these issues is influenced at least as much by the convenience of collecting results of blood-tests etc, as by other aspect of experimental design. I heard an interesting pod-cast recently on this topic, which pointed out that studies in which participants followed specific exercise protocols and ingested particular combinations of proteins, carbs etc before or after the sessions, had a limited daily window of at most an hour or two - i.e. while the participants were still routinely available in the "lab" setting - to collect the blood-samples on which these studies usually rely. Consequently much of the specificity of timing of the exercise or nutritional supplementation - destined forever-after to be interpreted by research-hounds as "best practice" - in actuality may well be simply an artefact of experimental convenience.

David

On 28 February 2010 05:52, Phil Voelker <mail4pvoelker@ yahoo.com> wrote:

Hi, Sanjeev -

Well, I don't do P90X; however I do weight train and cardio pretty substantially - I would argue that my regimen is probably similar, at least in terms of calories burned and the fact that it's a whole-body workout that changes all the time.

I can tell you from experience from a standard 'weight training diet' that they do work - but you do have to create almost a part-time job out of managing your nutritional intake and timing. There is certainly plenty of evidence that it works. Without knowing what the P90X diet specifically looks like, my guess is that it's high in protein, particular about good-quality carbohydrates and fresh vegetables, good fats, and low sodium.

I have found that Fast 5 works well for me. We're not the only ones - I read a fascinating article (New York Times) the other day about Stanley McChrystal - the commanding military officer in Afghanistan. He is a consummate military man. Completely lean and muscular, exercises like a madman, used to run his 12 mile commute every day . . . . .and for most of his adult life has subsisted generally one one meal per day, in order to not feel sluggish.

My take: If your physical demands are high and consistent, your body is going to adapt to either approach. I do suspect though, if your aim is more about muscle building than fat loss, that you would be in a more consistent anabolic state if you were taking in calories more regularly. Fast5, to me, is primarily a way to allow the body to use the energy it already has stored, and muscle-building would be secondary.

One other caveat - I'd certainly look to a professional like Dr. Herring to weigh in, but my reading indicates that the body's own ability to produce growth hormone actually increases when in a fasting state, so I think that there's some real potential advantages to a more ascetic eating schedule like Fast 5. I think it might be working for me, as I do feel that I'm getting stronger, more muscular, and leaner. I've just gotten back on the Fast 5 track after lagging over the holidays though - we'll see how things look come summer. :-)

Cheers,

Phil

--- On Sat, 2/27/10, sanjeev.bhadresa <sanjeev.bhadresa@ gmail.com> wrote:

From: sanjeev.bhadresa <sanjeev.bhadresa@ gmail.com>
Subject: [fast5] Fast5 and P90X
To: fast5@yahoogroups. com
Date: Saturday, February 27, 2010, 8:53 PM

Hey!

I have a question I hope someone can help me with.

I've been on the fast5 diet for around 6 weeks or so and am seeing a moderate reduction in weight (around a pound a week).

I've recently purchased the P90X system and noticed that they recommend a very different diet. It's taken me a while to transition to the fast5 and so really don't want to switch (besides I feel great......much better than I did eating multiple meals).

Does anyone have any experience they care to share?

I'm inclined to just start with the exercise part of the system and see what happens.

Sanjeev

__._,_.___

__,_._,___

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Re: [fast5] Fast5 and P90X

Very interesting take, Phil. I suppose the critical question would be whether the body can become (i.e. after any whatever transient adaptations are necessary) as efficient at using long-term stored calories, and previously-ingested stores of protein and other anabolic components, as it is presumed to be at exploiting immediately-available gut-contents in the "6-meal-a-day" paradigm. My suspicion would be - e.g. on evolutionary grounds - that it can (I think Dr Herring has commented on aspects of this) and indeed there are some quite proficient bodybuilders out there who have gained substantial muscle on an IF regime, e.g:

http://www.leangains.com/

I suspect the "continuous eating" approach is partly driven by the difficulty of ingesting large amounts of calories within a limited window, and partly because, in the absence of the critical adaptations, the trainer tends to feel weak without a regular energy "fix". Additionally, most men (and it's nearly always men) who want to gain bulk have a very unrealistic idea of just how much of any weight they add is really muscle. Certainly, if you ingest 1000s of extra calories per day in pursuit of a "bulking" phase you will gain lots of pounds and inches, but as physique competitors who subsequently have to "cut" down to the very low body-fat levels required for elite competition discover, the vast majority of the poundage gained in this way turns out to have been fat, not muscle. The "lean-gain" approach short-cuts this "inflationary-deflationary" cycle by using much more modest caloric increments to support the development of the same amount of underlying muscle without concomitant - and unhealthy - gains in fat.

One last point is that I suspect that much of the "lab" research on these issues is influenced at least as much by the convenience of collecting results of blood-tests etc, as by other aspect of experimental design. I heard an interesting pod-cast recently on this topic, which pointed out that studies in which participants followed specific exercise protocols and ingested particular combinations of proteins, carbs etc before or after the sessions, had a limited daily window of at most an hour or two - i.e. while the participants were still routinely available in the "lab" setting - to collect the blood-samples on which these studies usually rely. Consequently much of the specificity of timing of the exercise or nutritional supplementation - destined forever-after to be interpreted by research-hounds as "best practice" - in actuality may well be simply an artefact of experimental convenience.

David

On 28 February 2010 05:52, Phil Voelker <mail4pvoelker@yahoo.com> wrote:

Hi, Sanjeev -

Well, I don't do P90X; however I do weight train and cardio pretty substantially - I would argue that my regimen is probably similar, at least in terms of calories burned and the fact that it's a whole-body workout that changes all the time.

I can tell you from experience from a standard 'weight training diet' that they do work - but you do have to create almost a part-time job out of managing your nutritional intake and timing. There is certainly plenty of evidence that it works. Without knowing what the P90X diet specifically looks like, my guess is that it's high in protein, particular about good-quality carbohydrates and fresh vegetables, good fats, and low sodium.

I have found that Fast 5 works well for me. We're not the only ones - I read a fascinating article (New York Times) the other day about Stanley McChrystal - the commanding military officer in Afghanistan. He is a consummate military man. Completely lean and muscular, exercises like a madman, used to run his 12 mile commute every day . . . . .and for most of his adult life has subsisted generally one one meal per day, in order to not feel sluggish.

My take: If your physical demands are high and consistent, your body is going to adapt to either approach. I do suspect though, if your aim is more about muscle building than fat loss, that you would be in a more consistent anabolic state if you were taking in calories more regularly. Fast5, to me, is primarily a way to allow the body to use the energy it already has stored, and muscle-building would be secondary.

One other caveat - I'd certainly look to a professional like Dr. Herring to weigh in, but my reading indicates that the body's own ability to produce growth hormone actually increases when in a fasting state, so I think that there's some real potential advantages to a more ascetic eating schedule like Fast 5. I think it might be working for me, as I do feel that I'm getting stronger, more muscular, and leaner. I've just gotten back on the Fast 5 track after lagging over the holidays though - we'll see how things look come summer. :-)

Cheers,

Phil

--- On Sat, 2/27/10, sanjeev.bhadresa <sanjeev.bhadresa@gmail.com> wrote:

From: sanjeev.bhadresa <sanjeev.bhadresa@gmail.com>
Subject: [fast5] Fast5 and P90X
To: fast5@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, February 27, 2010, 8:53 PM

Hey!

I have a question I hope someone can help me with.

I've been on the fast5 diet for around 6 weeks or so and am seeing a moderate reduction in weight (around a pound a week).

I've recently purchased the P90X system and noticed that they recommend a very different diet. It's taken me a while to transition to the fast5 and so really don't want to switch (besides I feel great......much better than I did eating multiple meals).

Does anyone have any experience they care to share?

I'm inclined to just start with the exercise part of the system and see what happens.

Sanjeev

__._,_.___

__,_._,___

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Saturday, February 27, 2010

Re: [fast5] Fast5 and P90X

Hi,

I am not an exerciser. I believe that part of what makes fast five work is that after some time, say about 3 weeks, there is a gene that is activated, SIRT1, as well as increased hgh which facilitates good health. So with my understanding, stay with the fast five eating program, if you can easily accommodate some of their dietary recommendations within the eating window, do so. The intense exercise program will have health benefits of it's own. So if you can do it, than do it. You could see incredible results. There are quite a few programs out there that recommend fasting and fitness together. Since it takes a bit of time to activate the SIRT1 gene, don't mess it up by going off the fast five. If you find it isn't working for you, you could always change late.

Good luck to you, and of course, keep us posted.

--- On Sat, 2/27/10, sanjeev.bhadresa <sanjeev.bhadresa@gmail.com> wrote:

From: sanjeev.bhadresa <sanjeev.bhadresa@gmail.com>
Subject: [fast5] Fast5 and P90X
To: fast5@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, February 27, 2010, 7:53 PM

Hey!

I have a question I hope someone can help me with.

I've been on the fast5 diet for around 6 weeks or so and am seeing a moderate reduction in weight (around a pound a week).

I've recently purchased the P90X system and noticed that they recommend a very different diet. It's taken me a while to transition to the fast5 and so really don't want to switch (besides I feel great......much better than I did eating multiple meals).

Does anyone have any experience they care to share?

I'm inclined to just start with the exercise part of the system and see what happens.

Sanjeev

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Re: [fast5] Fast5 and P90X

Hi, Sanjeev -

Well, I don't do P90X; however I do weight train and cardio pretty substantially - I would argue that my regimen is probably similar, at least in terms of calories burned and the fact that it's a whole-body workout that changes all the time.

I can tell you from experience from a standard 'weight training diet' that they do work - but you do have to create almost a part-time job out of managing your nutritional intake and timing. There is certainly plenty of evidence that it works. Without knowing what the P90X diet specifically looks like, my guess is that it's high in protein, particular about good-quality carbohydrates and fresh vegetables, good fats, and low sodium.

I have found that Fast 5 works well for me. We're not the only ones - I read a fascinating article (New York Times) the other day about Stanley McChrystal - the commanding military officer in Afghanistan. He is a consummate military man. Completely lean and muscular, exercises like a madman, used to run his 12 mile commute every day . . . . .and for most of his adult life has subsisted generally one one meal per day, in order to not feel sluggish.

My take: If your physical demands are high and consistent, your body is going to adapt to either approach. I do suspect though, if your aim is more about muscle building than fat loss, that you would be in a more consistent anabolic state if you were taking in calories more regularly. Fast5, to me, is primarily a way to allow the body to use the energy it already has stored, and muscle-building would be secondary.

One other caveat - I'd certainly look to a professional like Dr. Herring to weigh in, but my reading indicates that the body's own ability to produce growth hormone actually increases when in a fasting state, so I think that there's some real potential advantages to a more ascetic eating schedule like Fast 5. I think it might be working for me, as I do feel that I'm getting stronger, more muscular, and leaner. I've just gotten back on the Fast 5 track after lagging over the holidays though - we'll see how things look come summer. :-)

Cheers,

Phil

--- On Sat, 2/27/10, sanjeev.bhadresa <sanjeev.bhadresa@gmail.com> wrote:

From: sanjeev.bhadresa <sanjeev.bhadresa@gmail.com>
Subject: [fast5] Fast5 and P90X
To: fast5@yahoogroups.com
Date: Saturday, February 27, 2010, 8:53 PM

Hey!

I have a question I hope someone can help me with.

I've been on the fast5 diet for around 6 weeks or so and am seeing a moderate reduction in weight (around a pound a week).

I've recently purchased the P90X system and noticed that they recommend a very different diet. It's taken me a while to transition to the fast5 and so really don't want to switch (besides I feel great......much better than I did eating multiple meals).

Does anyone have any experience they care to share?

I'm inclined to just start with the exercise part of the system and see what happens.

Sanjeev

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[fast5] Fast5 and P90X

Hey!

I have a question I hope someone can help me with.

I've been on the fast5 diet for around 6 weeks or so and am seeing a moderate reduction in weight (around a pound a week).

I've recently purchased the P90X system and noticed that they recommend a very different diet. It's taken me a while to transition to the fast5 and so really don't want to switch (besides I feel great......much better than I did eating multiple meals).

Does anyone have any experience they care to share?

I'm inclined to just start with the exercise part of the system and see what happens.

Sanjeev

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[fast5] Ramadan

Fast-5 is similar to the practice of Ramadan, a month of fasting for Muslims.
For a whole month, they don't eat, drink or smoke from dawn to sunset. After sunset they feast and party. Children, the elderly, pregnant women and anyone who is sick is excused from fasting.

When I first learned about it, I thought it was horribly unhealthy. Now I have much more respect for it.

One thing I still don't understand about Ramadan is that they don't drink water during the day. That would worry me. But millions have been practicing it for centuries.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ramadan

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[fast5] Re: Looking for help from old timers!

Thanks, guys. That's exactly the insight I needed. Onward and downward!

--- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, David Nyman <david@...> wrote:
>
> Yes, I had the same experience, when shedding fat, that restricting my
> eating to a shorter window - essentially one meal, with perhaps some extra
> fruit if additional "snacks" are wanted - worked very well for discipline.
> I dropped fat steadily at the rate of about 4 pounds a month (I exercise
> quite a lot too, to keep muscle mass and metabolism high). Then, like Linda
> suggests, I started adding an additional small meal, when I wanted one,
> during a somewhat longer window, though still usually not more than 3-4
> hours (say between 5pm and 8 or 9pm). In the longer run (several years)
> I've maintained, rather than changed, my body composition quite easily in
> this way.
>
> If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
>
> David
>
> On 27 February 2010 15:01, Linda Eichblatt <linda.eichblatt@...>wrote:
>
> >
> >
> > My advice is to stay with what you're currently doing. When and if you
> > achieve your perfect weight, then you can elongate your window to maintain,
> > not lose, weight.
> >
> > Linda in Cowtown
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Feb 26, 2010 at 1:24 PM, fast5vegan <no_reply@yahoogroups.com>wrote:
> >
> >>
> >>
> >> I've lost about twenty pounds since January 1 using a one hour window, but
> >> I'm thinking about extending my window because I know over the long haul
> >> (the rest of my life) it's going to make more sense. I'm just afraid that
> >> I'll stop losing weight. Does anybody have any experience with changing
> >> their eating window time? Does it follow that less fat will be burned?
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> > --
> > Regards,
> > Linda Eichblatt
> >
> >
>

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Re: [fast5] Looking for help from old timers!

Yes, I had the same experience, when shedding fat, that restricting my eating to a shorter window - essentially one meal, with perhaps some extra fruit if additional "snacks" are wanted - worked very well for discipline. I dropped fat steadily at the rate of about 4 pounds a month (I exercise quite a lot too, to keep muscle mass and metabolism high). Then, like Linda suggests, I started adding an additional small meal, when I wanted one, during a somewhat longer window, though still usually not more than 3-4 hours (say between 5pm and 8 or 9pm). In the longer run (several years) I've maintained, rather than changed, my body composition quite easily in this way.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

David

On 27 February 2010 15:01, Linda Eichblatt <linda.eichblatt@gmail.com> wrote:

My advice is to stay with what you're currently doing. When and if you achieve your perfect weight, then you can elongate your window to maintain, not lose, weight.

Linda in Cowtown

On Fri, Feb 26, 2010 at 1:24 PM, fast5vegan <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

I've lost about twenty pounds since January 1 using a one hour window, but I'm thinking about extending my window because I know over the long haul (the rest of my life) it's going to make more sense. I'm just afraid that I'll stop losing weight. Does anybody have any experience with changing their eating window time? Does it follow that less fat will be burned?

--
Regards,
Linda Eichblatt

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Re: [fast5] Looking for help from old timers!

My advice is to stay with what you're currently doing. When and if you achieve your perfect weight, then you can elongate your window to maintain, not lose, weight.

Linda in Cowtown

On Fri, Feb 26, 2010 at 1:24 PM, fast5vegan <no_reply@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

I've lost about twenty pounds since January 1 using a one hour window, but I'm thinking about extending my window because I know over the long haul (the rest of my life) it's going to make more sense. I'm just afraid that I'll stop losing weight. Does anybody have any experience with changing their eating window time? Does it follow that less fat will be burned?

--
Regards,
Linda Eichblatt

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[fast5] nut milk for opening the eating window

http://www.youtube.com/v/TvXx8c2j2KA&color1=0xb1b1b1&color2=0xcfcfcf&hl=en_US&feature=player_embedded&fs=1
ï¿½lia Regina
Curitiba Pr
Brazil

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[fast5] I am losing weight

I finished week 2; week 3 starts tomorrow. I am eating way less food, and spending less time cooking and less money buying food. I may have lost as much as 5 lbs, not sure, because my scale is not accurate, but the numbers are going down.... YAY!

I did go off a bit, my eating window longer than 5 hours a couple days.

But I am not craving chocolate anymore, I used to crave chocolate. It's easier for me to stay away from sweets on this. So great!

YAY!

- Tamara

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Re: [fast5] Re: Eating less.

Interesting.... me too.... I'm eating a lot less... I think our stomachs srink after some time.........

On Sun, Feb 21, 2010 at 3:58 PM, Heidi overbeek <heidioverbeek@yahoo.com> wrote:

I find I am eating way less too. I am not actively trying to eat less, even though I have about 65 lbs to lose. it just is working that way. As I was making my lunch for work this morning (and throwing away a bag of unopened spinach) I thought - I need to buy less. Initially I was eating a lot of nuts and dried fruits - I think my mind or body or both wanted the extra calories. Now I find myself very satisfied 1 or 2 meals w/ a large serving of meat, a veggie, a fruit.

Heidi

--
Élia Regina
Curitiba Pr
Brazil

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Sunday, February 28, 2010

Saturday, February 27, 2010

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