Fast-5 Diet and Lifestyle: [fast5] Re: Hitting the wall

Hi tiathi13,

Congratulations on your perservance!

The best thing about FF for me isn't the weight loss, but that I'm
finally listening to what this old, battered carcass of mine is trying
to tell me. (BTW, I'm delighted with my weight loss : 6 lbs in 2
weeks--but 13% =>9% body fat! ).

So I'm taking it day-by-day. If Idon't always make the 19-hr fast, it's
no catastrophe. I know I can always get to 15 or 16 hours no problem. If
I can do FF most of the time, I'll still lose weight. Luckily, I only
have at most 5-10 lbs. to burn off. I will not give up my weight
workouts, though. They're essential. For example, all the weight I lost
is fat. The only measurement that changed was my waist (1 and a half
inches), which means I've kept my muscle. So if I have to eat a little
something before my window now and then to get some good training in, so
be it.

Good luck with FF. You can do this.

Paul

--- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, "tiathi13" <tiathi13@...> wrote:
>
> I'm on day 3 of FF. This is my second attempt in two years. I know
that the way my body naturally stores fat (low metabolism, genes) - I
will need to incorporate exercise soon. On my first attempt on FF I
stopped losing -then got discouraged, and even afraid to overdo it with
exercise. Knowing myself, when I get going, my tendency is to do too
much too soon too too fast....so I put the breaks on quick the first
time.
>
> Now, that's a good point about listening to your body. This time, Day
3 feels much like day 10. I'm thinking, when your body needs a lighter
day of exercise-do it. When it feels like it could handle a bit more, do
that. I suppose the secret is to learn how to read yourself better.
>
> --- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, Churyl Zeviar churyl@ wrote:
> >
> > I used to feel this way, too. It was all about not getting enough
fat in
> > my diet. Now I blend raw animal fat with broth in a blender, and
feel so
> > amazing! Avocado, nuts, coconut oil and dairy fat also help. But I
was
> > doing these when I was getting light-headed, and they weren't enough
for
> > me.
> >
> >
> > On Sun, 24 Jan 2010 8:41 am, David wrote:
> > > Hi Paul
> > >
> > > I've had a thought about your comment re feeling light-headed, as
you
> > > say you also did when low-carbing, and your feeling of weakness
when
> > > working out. I wonder if your muscles aren't (yet) storing enough
> > > glycogen to power your strenuous workouts adequately? You probably
need
> > > more adaptation time to give your muscles the strong hint that
they
> > > need to suck it up when you make it available in your window, but
you
> > > might also consider upping your carbs a bit, at least for a while,
to
> > > see if this has any effect. I do sometimes wonder whether the
low-carb
> > > approach is best when there is a high level of daily demand for
muscle
> > > glycogen - we know that racing cyclists and others who need both
> > > endurance and burst strength tend to load up on carbs prior to
> > > strenuous efforts.
> > >
> > > In my own case I eat a fairly modest amount of carbs for a Brit of
my
> > > generation - potatoes, rice, pasta, bread, fruit etc, but
restricted to
> > > what's possible within a fairly brief window. But at this stage my
> > > muscles know to "come and get it" when it's available, and I can't
> > > recall the last time I felt weak or "bonked" (in the American
sense, I
> > > hasten to add!)even after hard HIIT sessions or extended hikes
etc.
> > > This certainly didn't used to be true though, so some pretty
> > > significant shifts have clearly occurred over time. I suspect they
will
> > > for you too.
> > >
> > > David
> > >
> > > --- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, "Scaramouche" <scaramouche_54@>
wrote:
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Hi David,
> > >> Thanks for the informative post. I envy your ability to workout
hard
> > >> while fasting. I'd love to do "pure" FF all the time, but I'll
> > >> probably
> > >> have to break into it gradually. Although the first week went
pretty
> > >> well, I ended up feeling weak. I never get hungry when fasting, I
get
> > >> weak instead. Not good for the heavy (for me) workouts I'm doing
now.
> > >>
> > >> You're absolutely right about your body sending very clear
signals.
> > >> Learned more about my reactions to food and exercise in 10 days
than
> > >> in
> > >> the past 20 years. I'm amazed at how little food I can eat and
still
> > >> workout. The problem is, I don't feel comfortable enough with FF
to do
> > >> it daily. Yet.
> > >>
> > >> I'm doing a strength program that will be pretty intense very
soon.
> > >> Although I weathered a couple of workouts doing FF, I had to go
> > >> slower.
> > >> Also felt a bit lightheaded and in a somewhat "altered state". I
used
> > >> to
> > >> get this on very low carbs. I don't have the confidence to haul
heavy
> > >> weights when I 'm not feeling 100% strong.
> > >>
> > >> So I'm adapting FF somewhat. I never eat breakfast anyway, so
waiting
> > >> until 12:30 or 1pm to eat is no problem. Then no calories until
dinner
> > >> (8pm or so). I'll also do two 24-hr fast days like in Eat Stop
Eat.
> > >> When
> > >> I get used to this, I'll start adding FF fasting.
> > >>
> > >> I'm in no hurry. I've already gained valuable knowledge about how
my
> > >> body works. Especially the key to fat loss: eat less. . .a lot
less.
> > >> Duh! In my heart of hearts, I've always known this, but did not
want
> > >> to
> > >> accept it. Thought I could get away with eating as much as I
wanted
> > >> and
> > >> doing tons of exercise to burn off the excess calories. Problem
is, my
> > >> excess managed to stay just ahead of what I was burning. Even
after 3
> > >> years of running and heavyhands, I only lost 5 pounds--and still
had
> > >> handles. With FF I lost 5 pounds in 10 days, and doing a lot less
> > >> exercise !!
> > >>
> > >> Paul
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> --- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, David Nyman <david@> wrote:
> > >> >
> > >> > Hi Paul
> > >> >
> > >> > I agree with a lot of Heather's observations, although I would
add,
> > >> from my
> > >> > own experience, that adaptation is a key element too, and this
may
> > >> take some
> > >> > time (you may recall my recent comments to this effect on your
> > >> blog).
> > >> Like
> > >> > you, I exercise a fair amount most days, a lot of it with
Heavyhands
> > >> (again
> > >> > like you, I think), and for the last few years of IF I've had
no
> > >> problem
> > >> > doing this on my normal feeding schedule (these days about
21/3)
> > >> even
> > >> when
> > >> > the amount of exercise is a good deal more extended than usual
(say
> > >> a
> > >> day's
> > >> > skiing, or climbing a "Munro"). Recently, I decided to drop my
"set
> > >> point"
> > >> > a few pounds and consequently for the last couple of months
have
> > >> been
> > >> > maintaining a calorie deficit of 500-750 a day, between
exercise and
> > >> > reduction of intake, as witnessed by a loss of about 1.5 lbs of
fat
> > >> > (according to my Tanita!) per week - about 12 lbs in total so
far.
> > >> During
> > >> > this time I've been exercising about an hour a day, and had
plenty
> > >> of
> > >> energy
> > >> > for this and other daily activities, with no significant hunger
> > >> pangs.
> > >> I
> > >> > don't make a fetish out of the carb/protein/fat calculations,
but
> > >> eat
> > >> a mix
> > >> > of fresh foods from all categories - meat, fish, eggs,
potatoes,
> > >> rice,
> > >> > pasta, bread, salads, veggies etc.
> > >> >
> > >> > Now, if I go back ten years or so - "pre IF", there's no way I
could
> > >> have
> > >> > done any of this. I was often hungry during the day, despite
> > >> frequent
> > >> > feeding, no matter what sort of physical activity I was engaged
in,
> > >> and
> > >> > sometimes used to feel quite faint (for which my explanation
was
> > >> "low
> > >> blood
> > >> > sugar" and the consequent remedy to eat something sweet). My
> > >> transition to
> > >> > IF was achieved originally by moving to eating fruit and raw
veg
> > >> (mainly
> > >> > carrots) during the day, simply because I was overweight and
thought
> > >> this
> > >> > would be a neat way to reduce calories whilst staving off
hunger
> > >> pangs. So
> > >> > it proved. But then I also found that I "forgot" to get hungry
until
> > >> later
> > >> > and later in the day, until ultimately my bag of fruit lay
untouched
> > >> and I
> > >> > conceived the idea of the evening eating window (I was
sufficiently
> > >> > pig-headed to value my ongoing experience over comments that
this
> > >> was
> > >> > crazy).
> > >> >
> > >> > I can't remember exactly how long all this took, but it was
> > >> certainly
> > >> > several months. On the other hand, I wasn't really
"end-gaining" at
> > >> the
> > >> > time, but rather experimenting to see if I could change my
long-term
> > >> > patterns and habits. I'm a computer guy, not a biologist, but
it
> > >> seems
> > >> that
> > >> > the body is capable of making very significant adjustments to
its
> > >> internal
> > >> > regime as a consequence of the long-term pattern of demands we
make
> > >> on
> > >> it,
> > >> > and many if not most of the various "dramatic" short-term
symptoms
> > >> so
> > >> much
> > >> > discussed on this forum - often a consequence of pushing too
hard,
> > >> in
> > >> my
> > >> > view - are, in the end, insignificant, though very capable of
> > >> upsetting the
> > >> > apple-cart ("I just can't do this") if short-term "progress" is
> > >> > over-valued. As Heather say, raised cortisol is sometimes a
> > >> consequence of
> > >> > initial fasting stress, but this should subside - my own
resting
> > >> heartrate
> > >> > is 40-42 an hour or so after hard exercise, and it continues in
this
> > >> > leisurely way during fasts up to 24 hours or so. If a relaxed
heart
> > >> beat is
> > >> > a pointer to low levels of physical stress, then this bears
witness
> > >> that any
> > >> > initial excess of cortisol is a response to something unusual,
and
> > >> subsides
> > >> > as the body adapts.
> > >> >
> > >> > So I guess I'm saying keep on keeping on, carefully evaluating
how
> > >> you
> > >> > respond to various changes in your daily pattern of nutrition
and
> > >> > exercising, and bearing in mind that this is a journey that
nobody
> > >> is
> > >> timing
> > >> > but that is leading you ultimately towards a more functional
and
> > >> satisfying
> > >> > balance of these factors. The journey, I've found, is itself an
> > >> interesting
> > >> > experience and you will inevitably learn things about yourself
and
> > >> your
> > >> > potential that nobody on this board, or off it, could have told
you.
> > >> Do
> > >> > keep us posted!
> > >> >
> > >> > David
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> >
> > >> > 2010/1/21 Scaramouche scaramouche_54@
> > >> >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Thanks very much for your detailed reply, Heather. I was
worried
> > >> that
> > >> > > something wonky was going on. I'm relieved that others have
> > >> experienced
> > >> > > these things, also. Even though I don't have that much weight
to
> > >> lose (maybe
> > >> > > 10 lbs.), I'm feeling so good from fasting every day I don't
want
> > >> to
> > >> stop
> > >> > > unless I'm forced to. There are plenty of IF options, but I
love
> > >> the
> > >> > > convenience of Fast-5. I'll just have to eat more at night
and see
> > >> how it
> > >> > > goes.
> > >> > >
> > >> > > Paul
> > >> > >
> > >> > > __________
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > My workout blog <http://hhpanaerobics.blogspot.com/>
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > > --- In fast5@yahoogroups.com, Heather Twist HeatherTwist@
wrote:
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > You might want to listen to your body. I've never worked
out
> > >> that
> > >> hard
> > >> > > > myself, but my spouse and daughter do. They work out very,
very
> > >> hard.
> > >> > > > And often, then go into sugar craving mode. And eat sugar.
And
> > >> it
> > >> > > > hasn't hurt them one whit. My guess is that their glycogen
> > >> stores
> > >> are
> > >> > > > just empty and need to be refilled. Healthy sugars/starches
are
> > >> > > > obviously better than junk, but workouts use up a lot of
> > >> glycogen.
> > >> In
> > >> > > > non-workout mode, your body uses up mostly fat. But in
workout
> > >> mode,
> > >> > > > it can use up mostly glycogen.
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > The headache/brain fog mode though, is often just excess
> > >> cortisol.
> > >> > > > It's a hormone, and it makes you feel lousy. You can
sometimes
> > >> trick
> > >> > > > your body into producing adrenaline or insulin to
counteract it
> > >> ... a
> > >> > > > little bit of exercise, a little food, something acidic
(lemon
> > >> juice
> > >> > > > or vinegar). For some reason just plain lettuce works for
me,
> > >> though
> > >> > > > it takes 15 minutes or so for it to take effect.
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > As for thirst, I find that generally when my body is losing
> > >> weight
> > >> or
> > >> > > > changing shape. It can also mean you need more
electrolytes,
> > >> esp.
> > >> if
> > >> > > > you are on a low-salt diet (hard workouts with low salt can
> > >> cause
> > >> > > > major problems for some people). What Fast-5 seems to do
more
> > >> than
> > >> > > > anything is enable people to hear what their bodies are
saying.
> > >> For
> > >> > > > people who don't use many calories and are carrying too
many,
> > >> that
> > >> > > > means their appetite will decrease. But for people who need
> > >> calories,
> > >> > > > or protein, or water ... it means appetite for these things
> > >> might
> > >> > > > increase. Your body has an extremely accurate chemistry set
> > >> built
> > >> > > > right in, and a lot of your nervous system is built to
encourage
> > >> you
> > >> > > > to consume the things that are needed. It's sending you
> > >> messages!
> > >> Try
> > >> > > > listening to it and see what happens.
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > On Wed, Jan 20, 2010 at 2:22 PM, Scaramouche
scaramouche_54@
> > >> wrote:
> > >> > > > > Hello everyone,
> > >> > > > > I'm on day 10 and experienced what I call "hitting the
wall"
> > >> this
> > >> > > morning. I'm 55, quite active and in good shape from lifting
> > >> weights, biking
> > >> > > to work, cardio and aikido twice a week. Since starting FF,
I've
> > >> cut
> > >> way
> > >> > > back on my workout intensity until I adjust.
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > > Aside from day 4, I've been feeling generally very good.
> > >> Workouts have
> > >> > > been normal. Last night I had a bigger dinner than usual, but
> > >> didn't
> > >> eat
> > >> > > anything out of the ordinary. So far, so good.
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > > But this morning I woke up with major brain fog, headachy
and
> > >> a
> > >> bit
> > >> > > nauseous. I tried to ignore it, but before leaving for work I
just
> > >> HAD to
> > >> > > eat. Felt immediately better after eating a bit. Was okay for
the
> > >> morning,
> > >> > > but ate my normal small lunch as a precaution anyway. Then I
began
> > >> to feel
> > >> > > normal.
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > > When I got home after work I began craving sugar like
mad.
> > >> This
> > >> is
> > >> > > totally not normal for me. I don't like sweets. Ate a couple
of
> > >> fruit rolls,
> > >> > > a handful of chocolates and some chocolate spread on
crackers.
> > >> Followed that
> > >> > > with cheese and a couple more crackers. Dinner was a
medium-sized
> > >> steak, a
> > >> > > huge serving of whole wheat pasta and a glass of wine. This
is a
> > >> LOT
> > >> of food
> > >> > > for me; at 5'5" and 137 lbs. I'm not a big person and
normally do
> > >> not eat
> > >> > > this much. And the sugar craving is totally abnormal for me.
I
> > >> rarely eat
> > >> > > cookies, cake, chocolate, etc.
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > > Has anyone else had a similar problem? I'm a little
worried
> > >> about
> > >> > > fasting tomorrow. Breakfast won't be a problem. I never eat
it
> > >> anyway. But
> > >> > > maybe I should ease into the full 19-hour fast more slowly.
Or
> > >> just
> > >> not fast
> > >> > > every day. I've also been very thirsty all the time since
starting
> > >> FF (like
> > >> > > with a low carb diet). Any thoughts?
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > > Cheers,
> > >> > > > > Paul
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > > ------------------------------------
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > > >
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > --
> > >> > > > Heather Twist
> > >> > > >
> > >> > > > www.dunkers.us
> > >> > > > Kraut: the easy way!
> > >> > > >
> > >> > >
> > >> > >
> > >> >
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> >
>